Ok, so maybe I'm the only one but I'm quite bored of seeing shit threads being made on a regular basis for what I assume is nothing more than to gain some extra points for the VIP mapping. I'm just wondering if this is something that annoys other people?

The business districts are rife with it and there's a few occasions where I've seen that the only reason for people posting is specifically to earn points by posting in inactive threads, made long ago.

As many of you are aware, we've seen people admin jailed for their woeful attempts at gaining some extra vip mapping recently and I'm glad the admins are clamping down on it, as players I think it's important we monitor this sort of behaviour as well though. It's not right that some little pissant can just knock up a shit thread in multiple cities in order to gain their district mapping. It also leads to other pissants then doing the same thing.

There are several threads that I've seen recently where I'm reading them and it's just shit. The quality is poor and there's just no real point or structure to it.

If you're going to take part in a role play thread at least have some idea as to what your story is about, that way you can keep it on track and give people specific parts. Posting 2 lines here and there in response to some other shit someone's said makes for shit reading. I have seen some amazing role play threads over the years within the streets, if done well these can be enjoyable to read but the recent ones I have seen are quite sloppy and poor quality with no real structure to the story. The first few posts seem to be decent but then the ideas behind it run out and then we're left with 3 pages of shit posts.

Again, the business districts are the same, although they are businesses and customers will arrive asking for their favourite drink or what toppings they want on a pizza to me it's just lazy and unoriginal. I put a fair amount of thought into my own business and came up with a way to utilize the tipping part of the threads and to make actual money from it, rather than have some cunt come up and ask me for a glass of coke and I oblige and then ramble on for 12 pages about shit all. I just think the lack of quality there is wrong, fortunately people can no longer get away with copy and pasting menu's in order to gain themselves extra points, instead they've substituted that with a 12 lined paragraph about how white the clouds were that day or something equally as turd like. Of course, this kind of thing is allowed but it just makes for poor reading. If you actually care about your business you'll want to see some quality in it, rather than a load of drivel for numerous pages.

I've also seen people posting in inactive business district threads, for the sole purpose of avoiding giving the creator of the active business the perks they should have gained from having replies to their thread. I have recently made a suggestion on this and hopefully this sort of thing is stopped as it would be hard to RP burn all inactive businesses. Posting for points is a massive thing right now, I see it more and more each day and the quality of the role playing threads within the game right now is very poor.

I'm just wondering, as I asked before, if it's something that annoys other people as much as it annoys me? And if so, does anyone have any ideas on how to address it?

I agree that the VIP system can incentivise people to spam large quantities of low quality posts. I don't believe there's any problem whatsoever with someone posting something of quality in order to get VIP points for their district, but when I have to navigate my way through threads that are crappy inside jokes or 'giving away puppies', I get annoyed. What's more - it's blatant abuse of the VIP system. 

Tackling this problem is really difficult. Why? We don't want to scare new speakers out of the streets - a problem previously discussed by Satanta. If we demand and enforce consistent high quality, interesting posts from everyone, street activity could collapse.

I think we can find a solution as players. We need to make sure that if someone chooses to take VIP mapping, they take on a responsibility to put effort into their posts. 

Utopia, I don't think there's actually that much wrong with a decently written inside joke thread. Possibly if you're never in on any of those kinds of threads, it'd be annoying, but in general, if it's well written it's definitely better than any of the complete and utter dogshit that gets posted on what should be interesting and open subjects by people who can barely write their own names.

Achilles, provide solid examples, with links, or else you're just being a dick for the sake of it.

Here's on Kuku: https://mafiareturns.com/comm/thread/480933#90957949

As long as it's within the rules of RP posting I don't see why anyone can complain about it. What you think is annoying someone else might find great enjoyment out of. There are those that choose not to take part in any part of the RP aspect of the game, some of these people most likely think the majority of the threads out there are annoying because they don't like to RP. There are also those that are poor writers as well, but still like to RP so they try there best and a lot of people just assume that they don't care and are just after the XP when they are actually trying their best. 

For the businesses where the owner has died, I see how if we are RPing correctly that business would be closed unless a new owner chose to take it over and with current game play I don't think anyone would choose to take someone elses thread over as they wouldn't receive points for the other responses as if it were their own thread. Am I annoyed with this though? No. Why complain about descriptive RP? Setting the scene is one of the most important and forgotten about parts of RP. 

If you care about the growth of your character, XP/VIP points for mapping should always be in the back of your mind when you are posting. To me it seems that you are being extremely picky, and if we the players are going to do something about it what will we do? Fine people that can't RP well so that they are too afraid to come to the streets and then we have even fewer posters? We already have an issue with people that don't like to frequent the streets for fear of being being mocked and harassed for something they say incorrectly or said without thought. Issue with that is who would get the money if it is on the streets? So now your left with a nasty MM, shooting a few BG's if they have them or kill them. All are pretty harsh if they are well within the rules of posting in places that give XP.

If someone is posting long enough for VIP points to be distributed to them, and they're not breaking any rules, then I'm not exactly sure what the problem is here. Who cares if its not original enough for you? or too silly? or not something you want to read? If this is the case then I'm sure you would know after reading the first few lines the thread is not for you and you can just quickly opt to not read any further. Withholding a response, and not tipping is the best way you can deal with these.

As for the extremely short threads which look like they take no effort, I'm more than sure the VIP points are so low that they're almost negligible. So I don't believe its for the VIP and more just this is what they believe is the extent of how they can roleplay, and I think there are quite a few people who are trying to do something about this.

Teaching the newer players, or the ones who may not have a firm grasp of English for whatever reason (different country, younger kid, etc;) how to write a roleplay is probably the best way to get rid of these kinds of threads. Curtis opened up some sort of workshop earlier this month in the Streets, perhaps more things like that are in order? Teaching is the best way to battle ignorance.

Well said Ted.

Not everyone's tastes are the same, which is fine because that would be boring, but we do all have one huge thing in common; we play a mafia simulation called MafiaReturns. Whether you have a penchant for pastries or a hankering for hugs, whatever you do should fall in line with the overall theme of the game because that is what we are here to be. I'm all for accepting a little tongue in cheek, often self-deprecating business thread which enables someone to circumvent our genre somewhat if that is what they want to do, because it isn't really hurting anybody.

What I don't think is acceptable however, is purposefully elongating your contribution for the sake of trying to score points. I pick Elsa's thread as a recent example of this, because I don't really understand why that needed 12 replies from the same individual, obviously pre-written, essentially just describing dialogue, which could have either been 1 condensed (and detailed) post or have actual interaction between the participants involved. I can only assume this was a deliberate strategy employed to boost the reply count, given the age and experience of the person doing it.

I also do not believe that setting some sort of precedent against these attempts at exploitation is going to drive new people away from posting. In fact, as most of us learn what is acceptable in terms of posting by imitation and examples, I would argue that not doing something about this is going to make things worse as new people are going to see this and think it is acceptable, when it shouldn't be.

I also think this kind of mentality.... 

If you care about the growth of your character, XP/VIP points for mapping should always be in the back of your mind when you are posting.

...is really dangerous.

XP/VIP mapping should be the reward for honing your character through contribution and not the ultimate goal. It should ideally be an afterthought; a pleasant consequence of something you intended to do anyway because what you had to offer was worthwhile. Perhaps that is idealistic, but I hope we haven't reached a point where posting is purely for the reward. That would make my forehead sad.

I personally enjoy posting in the business district more then the streets and do so for the info mainly, i do it to build my character but enjoy the vip/experience/credit gains it has brought me.  I will post in any business i see simply if i think can put a reply suited to itas honestly with so many business you can leave a reply and never get one back it is awful to look like some nutjob just talking to myself.

In regard to street threads and posting, the truth is i see all sorts of posts and some do make me wonder but i see same in the business district.  If is not something i see any interest in, i just pass it by but some people will always try and place something or place something people can't reply if looks like a thought, unless working off body language.

As for burning inactive businesses, the truth is in many cases will have very few left and then the similar quality come back is my main worry.  Out of the recent businesses i visited i bellieve ShayD, Corvo, Spunky and Elsa are best for getting a reply out but when i have more time i have to sit down in Whatsernames room for rp as unfortunately christmas run work wise is never a good one for free time

Also, i think at stages people is a section just happy to see something posted, just to have something to read.  We don't have papers anymore, much rp threads, stories etc.  One of the most interesting for me recently was ask deadlysin basically.

Over the last few months have seen people try and sell car models of present day and weapons in the 1930's environment.  As much as i try and talk people through on some these things and the time base of the game.  Is always going to be a few who post what they want is just giving the appropriate guidance, warning, punishment for leaders if it is repeated or requests ignored.

Finally, if planning an rp, is best sometimes if planned in back alleys even if early stages just to give a feel for direction but when it hits the streets, i honestly have found at stages sometimes is limited interaction or people try and hijack/spoil or the thread just dies

People need direction and schooling, and a start would be a RP Sticky explain how the fuck to RP! :) There is nothing really for the new players to MR and RP in general to read and sink their teeth into. This, would ben a good starting point.

Adz - there is a thread dedicated to roleplay engagement under help: https://mafiareturns.com/comm/thread/3908

Try that if you haven't already.

Some useful tips for anyone interested in RP, I'm sure. 

You the man baz! Might be better use as also a sticky in the streets itself. Maybe not better, but it could get more views there to help players that go straight there to post. Remember reading this, great thread and definitely useful.

In my opinion, it shouldn't be frowned upon unless it goes too far since it depends on the player on how he likes to play MR.

The XP reward system was created to encourage people to make sensible RP and other threads with rewards but people who abuse this feature to their own advantage should be stopped since they give in less effort than most people who follow the rules, which is unfair. Some post mainly for XP while others post mainly to gain popularity which could help you gain connections that could help you later on and a few post for the RP which they strive to maintain and preserve since it is one of the main reason they play this game.

Well, you want to post a lot of decent threads for the XP? Go for it, at least you're not spamming with short, thoughtless ones.

Want to RP since you want to keep proper role-playing alive? I encourage you to do so.

Want to gain more popularity in the Streets? Carry on, that is one of the most common reasons we do so, therefore, it's alright.

We have no right to tell you what to do except if you violate the rules so have fun playing this game.

Remember the XP system is a gift, learn how to use it properly!