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A Loyalist's Response Started by: Wade_Wilson on May 24, '16 03:29

To the victor goes the spoils...

Or something like that, right?  And that's the way it should be.  And I'm not here to throw sour grapes over those spoils.  Or to denigrate anything DoctorBoom did in his quest for power.  I think what he did was impressive.  And perhaps his motives are as he says.  I wouldn't know.  I wasn't privy to the meetings.  I was living under my father's roof.  Enjoying the good life.  I was only thrust into this life when my father was killed in his sleep, so I wanted to come out here and offer my perspective.  A response, if you will, on my father's behalf.  

If you haven't figured it out already, and you probably haven't because my father lived a somewhat unassuming existense, my father was WillHayes, a crewleader who resided in Downtown Detroit with Godfather SpikeS, and a leader authed by SpikeS.  

First, congratulations to DoctorBoom, and Chicago.  Brilliantly done.  

Here's the little trouble I have.

It's hard to expect people to believe you when you've lied.  

"I'm going to lie to you this time, but next time, I'm going to tell you the truth, honest." 

"Well, I lied to you last time, but this time I'm telling the truth, honest."

Wait, what?  Well, good news.  It doesn't matter.  The truth doesn't matter.  You don't owe anybody an explanation.  You don't have to come out to these streets and provide any explanation as to why you did what you did.  I know that a lot of people want an explanation, or want "transparency" but we aren't entitled to any of that.  But, if you do come out and offer an explantion that's full of lies one time, the next time you come out and offer an explanation...there's a chance people are going to assume it's full of lies.   So, just expect that people will question the veracity of your explanations from time to time.

As for DoctorBoom's explantion about SpikeS...it is what it is.  You all can form your own opinion.  You have the victor coming out here and offering an explanation.  You can take it for what it's worth.   He's the victor.  He doesn't owe any explanation.   He can come out here and moon you, leave, and that would be that.   Good enough for me.

I'm really here to offer my perspective on Spike.  

Like I said, my father was a crewleader who worked under Spike in Downtown Detroit.  He had many conversations with Spike.  Similar to DoctorBoom, he had many conversations with Spike about family members who were thought to be concerning to Spike for one reason or another.  There was never any paranoia, but Spike's legitimate concerns.  But not once did Spike ever demand that any member be killed.  He certainly may have requested some action, or sought to have a conversation, but was always willing to listen.  Just because he had a certain way about him didn't mean he wasn't willing to listen.  You just had to be willing to stand your ground.   And if you were in the right, Spike would respect your position, and defend it. 

You aren't alone DoctorBoom.  There are several crewleaders out there willing to defend their crewmembers over anything else.  I know my father certainly was.  And he certainly wasn't going to go killing any of them over any paranoia.  Of course, he never witnessed any of this paranoia from Spike.  So there was really no concern.   Not once did he kill a crewmember at Spike's request.

That's not to say there weren't people out to get Spike.  Obviously, any number of people were out to get Spike, so there was plenty of reason for concern.   I'm sure many are aware of the underground groups who formed with the purpose of attempting to disrupt and/or kill Spike.  So, what some call paranoia, others call concern based on evidence.  

Of note - my grandfather was also RH to Spike for quite a while, and he didn't witness any of this paranoia either.  

Now - on the issue of why Spike took his own life: This is an interesting question.  I have a theory.  Obviously I'm speciulating.  So, take this for what it's worth (not much) but it's an opinion, and one I share with a few others.  Spike was close to a few city heads.  Those included the city heads from NY, Philly and Chicago.  My feeling is this (having known him for a while now) Spike would have given  his life for any one of them...and had any one of them taken up their gun against Spike, he would have laid down his gun and taken his own life...instead of shooting those he was closest to.  He'd accomplished all he wanted to accomplish and was here to see those around him succeed.  He'd gladly lay down his gun for those he loved.  That's what he did.  

So, take this entire speech for what it's worth.   The rant of a Spike loyalist...that's what my father was, right?  A Spike loyalist?  Isn't that why he was killed?  Because he was a Spike loyalist?  That must be it, right?  I mean, nobody ever asked him if he was a Spike loyalist or whether he'd support removing Spike for the "good of the people."  Who knows what he would have said???  Nobody from Chicago knows.  They never asked.   Well, put your minds at ease, my father was indeed a Spike loyalist. Had he been awake during this, he would definitely have taken up the fight for Spike.  So, take this rant for what it is...a rant from a Spike loyalist.  

So, I say - this "Reckoning of SpikeS" was done brilliantly.  It was planned perfectly, executed tremendously well, and should be applauded.  The reasons don't matter.  I just wanted to offer a little perspective from my father, who sat in Detroit for a while with Spike.  

And a few more words, if I may, from my father, directly to DoctorBoom and the victors - I sincerely appreciate you allowing so many of Black Rock's former members to find homes after the mission was complete.  It was an honorable thing to do.  I am grateful.  

And to those former members of Black Rock who found homes, and who struggled with that decision - you made the right call.  Now go and live your lives honorably, and respectfully.  You served Black Rock well.  I hope you will serve your new leaders just as well, and make them as proud as you made my father.  Be active, have fun, and work hard. 

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To start, I would like to thank you for being so gracious in your approach in your speech.  Not many would have such poise in the face of what has happened.  I have nothing but respect for you, and your father.  It was my honor to be able to save so many of your former members even if your father himself could not be helped.   I knew that your father would go down with the ship no matter what given my and the Godfathers previous conversations about him.  Asking your fathers opinion on the matter would have been foolish on may part because I knew where his heart lay.

Now, to address the matter of my "lies".  As I hope you noticed in my other speech made the other day, they were not whole lies.  The reasons put forth for the destruction of New York and Philly are true as they did happen. SpikeS was considering taking their lives for the very same reasons.  Godfather WigglesFanGirl because of his actions, and Godmother Rayln because of her loyalty to the man.  The proof of this being SpikeS didn't turn around and murder me on the spot for stepping out of line.  He believed me when I said it was for his own good. WigglesFanGirl did threaten SpikeS, he did shoot bodyguards, and he did threaten my dear Maria.  Did I use this to my advantage?  Yes.  Did I manipulate the situation to meet my own objectives in protecting my city?  Yes.  I have never said anything different.  No one can ever say I lied.  I just didn't reveal my entire hand.  

As for the targeting of "loyalist".  I had many conversations with SpikeS about who he considered his closest allies.  He many times named certain people who had sworn undying fidelity to him.  That is why they were targeted.  In my conversations with him I was able to make mental notes of who would back the man without question.  I respect that kind of loyalty don't get me wrong.  There is something beautiful about it. When they take those oaths and say those words they are agreeing to die with him, and they did.  Maybe SpikeS over exaggerated the extent of their loyalty?  I do not know.  I just went by what the man said himself.  If your kin was targeted it was because SpikeS had claimed these people were eternally loyal to him.  They had to be removed for my own protection.  Asking each individual was never an option.

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A very commendable approach to voice your opinions, son of Will Hayes. If only we saw more of that.

The good Doctor has covered what I was going to challenge with, especially to consider that he could not have been expected to reveal the full extent of his weekend in the first instance. There was an opportunity where all the pieces fit, he just put them together in the right order.

My comments are on your view that there was no 'paranoia' across the country as individuals became stronger and had unknown agendas. It may well have been an isolated incident, however I know a man to have left signore Hayes service through fear of forcing him into a situation where he would have to challenge his Godfathers suspicions. From there it is a slippery slope that none could predict how hard or fast a man would reach the bottom.

I've learnt a great deal about my mentors time with Black Rock in the last month. I can't say I'd make the same choice he made in his final moments, but it must be said that there was an air of uncertainty about how far a man in his position could go.
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DoctorBoom pretty much summed up what was needed to be said. It would be folly for him to reveal his entire hand and admit that removing NY and PH was but the first steps in a plan that was well made and well organised.

As for ordering the killing of people and the short example you gave with regards to his paranoia and protecting your own family, I assume it would be easier to hold control over those undesirables he had in his own city due to working with them in close proximity, perhaps not to order a kill in your case but if you guys were close then he'd know if needed you could keep an eye on anybody he was concerned over. He didn't have that luxury in the other cities and had to depend on people he may not have been sure about keeping them in check and monitoring their capabilities with a gun, it would have been easier to be rid of the concern entirely than risk it.

Silk Glove if I recall correctly began as a result of bloodlining and their beef was that they had had enough of SpikeS ordering the killings of their parents and the leaders they had served obeying this command so the paranoia concern around them was his own doing.

I hope given what the previous speakers and myself have said you are no longer troubled by the "lies".

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