Sammy that is true and i agree with you 100%

clutch listens to the speech and takes a deep drink from his flask. Putting his cig out he makes a brief comment while there is a pause in the discussion. Stepping onto the box clutch clears his throat.

Just my thoughts on the matter at hand. Take it for what its worth, just figure I'd pipe in real fast. Since this topic was first brought up, it seems that 1 auth was in correct within the rules brought forth and the other was not. As it was stated by those in the conversation, its has been done a few times with the city in topic. We may not all agree, but that was what has been decided. But it was brought to our attention so we the masses all know.

As for the second part of needed the presence. Its a age old question lately around this world and at the moment, you have to have street presence to get that shiny bold suit. Have we seen leaders that were good that hardly spoke, yes. And we have seen leaders who were always in the streets that were not worth a pot to piss in. But at this current moment, this is part of how you get that suit. So therefor, if you want it you better start speaking in some way or another.

clutch takes a deep drink and glances back to the crowd.

Thats all I got folks, now if you excuse me, gotta make my way to the horsetrack and see why GoldNugget lost in the 4th. Have a good day.

One speech was made, enough presence for auth.

Cin smiled over at Ragnarok. Finally someone who paid attention as much as she did in this world. It was heartening to see.

So you have noticed this as well? While I am not a fan of forcing street presence, I am a fan of enforcing rules that leaders so openly set. I would truly love to see more leaders giving their opinions long before an authing occurs. Perhaps I am naive in that hope but I would think it would be something to truly see. Those hoping for an auth should be able to speak their minds on matters. I am not a fan of silence, at all.

She turned her head as something else said caught her attention. She focused on Job for a moment.

It's true that having a personality and an opinion can be detrimental. So are many other things. If you come from a bad bloodline (or at least what others deem as a bad bloodline), among other things. It's frustrating to see but if those people keep at it eventually the tides will change once or twice if you are really lucky.

SammyCrooks, to quote your Godfather:

With regard to the two auths that popped up in the last few hours. NealCaffrey authed PeterBurke and, regardless of my personal feeling toward the type of street appearance he made, Peter did fulfill the requirements of the ruling before he became a leader.

Street presence requirement for new leader

A rudimentary level of street speaking ability must be demonstrated by a potential leader in order to qualify them for authorisation to set up a new family. This is not a demand for a strong or consistent presence but there is a need for them to have made themselves known in the streets. If a potential leader can't manage one single coherent speech as a 'right of passage' then there should be serious doubts about their all-round capability, intelligence and determination to lead.

 

It is not a demand for strong or consistent presence. Peter has made himself known with his speech, and now he's sort of infamous in this little corner. 

As we've seen from his contributions to this.. discussion and from his speech he is certainly able to speak, and so I believe it's pointless to debate any further about the meaning of this rule.

Right, but that's on those that created the rule.

Deception is baffled by the conversation that has been taking place. The fact that this conversation is going on, even after it has been concluded that Peter has indeed fulfilled his requirements, is beyond his comprehension. He steps up to speak for a brief moment.

"Now I know I'm still new around these parts, but I would assume that respect is a bigger factor than having a huge presence in the streets. I understand the theory behind the law the GF Council laid down, and I completely agree with the fact that before someone is authed there should be a pretty good understanding of what that person is about. What I'm not understanding, however, is during this entire conversation the topic of respect hasn't been brought up as well. I've seen in this thread multiple different ranks from multiple different cities make some rather discourteous remarks to a CREW LEADER from another city. Maybe my understanding of This Thing of Ours is a little off, but is it not more important that those of lower rank show respect to those of higher rank, especially CL's and GF's?"

Deception pauses a moment to gather his thoughts. He is merely trying to objectively express another vantage point regarding this topic.

"In my humble opinion, I feel it's more important that those who are to be authed are effective leaders, show respect and can follow orders and the chain of command. Having a good street presence, again, is important to find out the type of person the future crew leader might be, but couldn't the same kind of information be found out from personal discussions? Should those who are of a lesser rank be able to publicly question the leadership abilities of a Crew Leader? These questions ARE NOT directed at any particular person but at this conversation as a whole. As has been stated several times, Peter has met the requirements and is in compliance with the rules set forth by the GF Council, so why is there still a problem? At this point, since it indeed has been made clear Peter is in compliance, I think any remarks that have been made since this declaration are, for a lack of better words, a sign of disrespect, not only to him but to those who authed him. If the GF Council says he's good to go, and NealCaffrey has vouched for Peter's ability to be a Crew Leader, is that not good enough? What the hell are we still arguing about here??"

Deception, feeling he got his point across, takes a step back away from the group. He decides to wait around to see how his point of view will be perceived. He hopes we can all move forward from this and wish Peter the best of luck with his crew, but is completely open to further discussion.  

Just to further this a bit more, this was said by Godfather Curtis, word for word, within the contents of the GFC ruling discussion...

I, and the rest of the leaders involved would agree with you. But if you look, a constant or impressive street presence is not required. Just something.

We all appreciate that leading is about making decisions, man management, strategy and a myriad of other skills. That much is obvious. But we live in a world made of words, so, it is not unreasonable to expect a prospective leader to publicly demonstrate (if only once) their capacity to communicate. 

If you already take part in the occasional discussion in the streets then you already qualify. If you have never spoken in the streets then one single discussion is asked. Not a series of talks, just one conversation. If a potential leader is too lazy to meet that simple requirement, were they ever worthy of consideration at all?

You can disagree with this, and I fully understand wanting there to be more than just a single speech requirement in order to obtain the rank of leader, but it was stated as clear as day that this is all that is required. If you do not agree then that is for you to take up with the Godfathers, but the current Chicago leader, like quite a few other leaders since this ruling has been instituted; have all followed this rule even if only the bare minimum. That's all I have to say about that.

And if the worst were to happen and my son were to go out and have to find himself a new family, I know that the first thing he'd be looking for is a leader that does the bare minimum.

Then again I would think you're a bit thick if you're making the decision of what crew you will join based upon a forced speech. Also, from further communication with Mr. Burke it has become apparent to me that he was engaged in otherworldly matters and has had very little sleep. Writing a speech with more 'fluff' than is absolutely necessary wasn't exactly on the top of his priorities. 

We can argue all day long about this, but the following has been established:

• Mr. Burke's speech was good enough to fulfill the requirements and thus the Loop followed the rules, contrary to what the opening speech states.

And I think that this is all there is to know. There is only a controversy or a problem if you want it to be one. I have to ask though: If Mr. Burke had made a thread about vague concepts like 'Loyalty' and the oh-so-popular topic of 'Respect', would you all have been content. Just because his little speech doesn't cover some rehashed concept, it is bad? 

Apologies for coming to this discussion so late, other things have kept me occupied for the past few hours. Personally I totally agree with the need for street presence in our current leaders. To be honest, I forgot to have a word with Peter prior to his auth about how we rarely see him wandering our streets. I think this is due to the clusterfuck of things that have happened in Chicago lately, I never thought I would be setting him up this soon. He knows that I hold it of high importance and has vowed that he will regularly be kicking around on street corners and giving his two cents to speeches.

I'm happy that this was brought to surface though Ragnarok if I am honest. I am glad you brought it to attention that there is still much work to be done in terms of having it a requirement for any even considered for auth, to have a street presence. I can tell you that Peter will always be around here and also that any future people I may auth shall have been here giving their thoughts on latest topics and discussions. I promise that not only to you, but to myself and the rest of my district. 

My bloodline hasn't always been the biggest street speaker, but the late Godfather Ajani made sure that I myself was. I now have a keen thirst to have the streets be a lively place with all current leaders giving their thoughts. I fully support the rule in which street presence should be a requirement, and I'm more than willing to follow suit and make sure it happens.