I'm not going to give a fancy or witty intro here, or pull out some
old soapbox just to put on a show. I'll get straight to the point, and
share what is on my mind.

Since when the fuck did we as made mobsters walk up to any "Joe
Slobola" and offer him work in this thing of ours, without even so much
as having a meaningful discussion with said individual, at HIS request?

Earlier this evening, my family lost a man due to his own
unfortunate actions here in Las Vegas. I'm not going to get into the
details, since it isn't the business of anyone other than those who
were involved. One of the deceased man's last requests was for us to
provide his son with a home, and help give him a start. Knowing the
work ethic and loyalty of this man, we agreed to honor this request,
with the hope that his son would follow in his father's footsteps and
learn from his mistakes.

Upon his arrival on these shores, he was hit with a barrage of
requests, asking him to join other outfits, without even so much as
getting to know him.

I'll cite one example:

"___________ are you looking to join the __________ outfit?



If so let me know"

Not even a hello, just flat out shameless recruitment.

This isn't the only one, but it was the most direct. At least some
folks had enough decency to say hello to this thug, before blindly
offering him a position within their ranks.

Is this what our world has come to? Made men, and even Crewleaders,
shamelessly recruiting warm bodies straight off the boat without even
so much as having a discussion of substance with them?

Fucking pathetic, if you ask me.

What ever happened to thugs approaching made members and inquiring
about possible opportunities? Isn't that how things are supposed to
work around here? Hell, if you aren't going to do that, at least spark
up a substantial conversation with a person and get to know them first
before offering a job. Is that still recruiting? Yes, but at least it
isn't completely shameless.

When my bloodline first got to these streets many years ago,  it
didn't have a clue as to how to even find a family, and a bullet to the
head ended any futile attempts my ancestor made of getting ahead on
their own. In time though, my bloodline figured it out and went on to
accomplish a few notable things along the way. Survival of the fittest,
baby. Those who want to learn will figure things out and evolve over
time.

Now that "The Honoured Society" has done enough work to get the
mythical gods of our world to alter a person's abilities (giving them a
disability, if you will!) when killing a -48 member of our world, they
can turn their attention to a new topic.

I'd like to respectfully suggest the subject of acceptable recruitment practices be something they take a serious look at.

I can't speak for other mobsters here, but this practice of blind
recruiting is completely unacceptable, in my humbly retarded opinion.

Feel free to add your own two cents, or debate. I look forward to seeing the opinions of others on this important topic.

I believe with the recent lack of numbers coming daily from our shores plus the prodding of City Hall to get crewleaders more active in the recruiting business, there really isn't an alternative. There have been countless warnings in the past of this happening (from the current trend, back then) and their warnings have finally given heed to the prophecy they predicted.


It's a cutthroat world in terms of recruiting - it's almost as if you have to give incentives to beat the other guy these days, which is quite sad.


Thankfully, I was birthed at a time when things weren't so desperate for bodies and I had to make an effort to get into a family.

I think everyone knows that it is happening, we are just waiting to see if the leaders of each city can come to some sort of agreement to regulate it.

It will be a difficult thing to enforce though because of all the sponsors out there who need associates... I am not completely against sponsors approaching people in order to recruit an associate (as long as it is done well... The example you gave is obviously completely unacceptable).

What I would like to see though as a bare minimum is no CL/RH/LH's approaching people for the purpose of recuitment. That to me is ridiculous and shouldn't be happening.

Wow...I say you sure are long winded... Because I am a rooster son, I don't read much...I did see one question though that caught my eye, however.

When you said: "Since when the fuck did we as made mobsters walk up to any "Joe

Slobola" and offer him work in this thing of ours, without even so much

as having a meaningful discussion with said individual, at HIS request?"

The easy and respectful answer, son is: "Because, if one family doesn't reel you in, another will"

It's been passed down to me by my father and his father etc etc. That bodies make you stronger. and I mean ANY body.

Hear me out, sah. Now, my pappy never actually went to people and asked for them to join the family, but he wasn't to far off of that, only because times change...like it or not. You are either in or you are out. The reason my pappy sent an invite out to anyone who asked is because it was good business.

Why...I say why is that you say? Well, what have you got to lose? If you invite an idiot, then when he screws up, you get to feed him to your hit squad to help them hone their skills. If he turns out to be a cash hound,  a great hitter, a fantastic businessman, then you also win.

It's win/win. If you tell the guy that can't speak well to beat it, then you are just giving that body to another family that will use him/her to better their squad or business.

Like wise with the "member whoring" you are just letting that other family whore your potential next Don...that or potential target for your squad

Well put, Mr. Leghorn.

You have highlighted all the positives of shameless recruiting, and I can't say I disagree with the points you've made.

Maybe I'm just old fashioned, or perhaps stubborn (go figure, right?), but I think there is a proper way to go about the business of bringing members into your organization.

What I've seen this evening is not an example of that, and that troubles me.

"Like wise with the "member whoring" you are just letting that other
family whore your potential next Don...that or potential target for
your squad"

That brings up another interesting discussion.

So based on the idea that accepting ANY body off the streets to build up strength in numbers is an acceptable and smart practice, isn't that a silent endorsement of "member whoring" by the current leadership?

Yet, I've seen folks come out to these streets and speak out against this very practice.

So really, where do we stand?

Member whoring was frowned upon back in the day because there was limited space and limited number of leaders. Finding the smart ones is the only way to stay alive. Back then you died for looking at someone wrong, there was less leaders and a MUCH higher turn over (per capita).

These days any idiot can run their own family. If you covered my eyes right now and asked me to name 5 of our current leaders I MIGHT be able to do it. Not because they are bad at their jobs, necessarily (though I am sure that some fit the role) but because there are so many of them. Keep your mouth shut and you get forgotten about.

Bottom line son, is that power is in numbers, anyone can follow if you have the right person leading and telling them what to do and how to do it. The ones that you can't lead are the ones that know enough to not allow you to lead them, do you really want that guy in your family?

If the person you are member whoring is smart enough to know it USED to be frowned upon, has likely already decided on his family before he was born anyway...so who gives a shit? you know?

Marley walks by saying

Recruiting is for coaches. Mon!

puffs his joint and tosses it

Well this topic is discussed every other day, no offense you sir. 

But is this "epidemic" really as bad as people say it is? I mean, are there THAT MANY people walking around with a temporary -48 tattoo everyday potentially looking to get into this thing of ours? I mean, I don't see boatloads upon boatloads of people pouring into our streets, and the few who do are almost always decendants of people who've recently passed on, they may not even be from the old country! 

But alas, as others have said... new blood is hard to find these days, and thus when people see what they think is a new peice of meat they pounce on it like a pack of hungry dogs, using whatever means neccessary to drag that peice of meat back into their hideout so they can use it as they please. Can you blame them? With so many families now, and so little blood to thrive off, what are people supposed to do?

Michael shrugs.

As you probably haven't noticed, but maybe it could be an idea for others to use:

I only recruit Zips - people from the old country whom I already know and can trust 100%, without a family line yet established here. Who better to recruit than someone you know, who will then remember that it was YOU who was the one to help establish their lineage and help it flourish. Thats how loyalty is created.

But alas, I've gone off on a tangent again, I best be off.

Shameless Member Whoring has always been here. You ask when it started, well probably around the time the Gods first created this world. When my ancestors first stepped of the boat in a strangely familiar world as this, there where member whores waiting. When I first stepped of the boat in this specific world, there where whores waiting. Its a matter of supply and demand. The Supply of fresh blood is low, and there are a shit loadf of crews, and families out there so demand for that new blood is at an all time high, forcing even more Mafiaoso down the track of touting Family business like a street walker on sunset boulevarde.

The last time this old chestnut was going around the streets I made two salient points.
1) |This has always been an issue and will always continue to be an issue, as long as my Family is stronger than yours cos mine has more members, and
2) The only way to stop member whoring is to get all GodFathers, Dons and Captains to agree to punish whoring by Death. Only then will you see a gradual reduction in whoring.

I say a gradual reduction because lets face it, you will never totally do away with whoring, same as you will never do away with random wacking and shooting at under 48 hr old gangsters. Especially when there is so much to be gained and there are whole cities of families out there publically endorsing whoring... and don't look at me like that, you know exactly what cities I'm referring too.

Well I think I have prattled on too long about this... particularly as this little gem keeps circulating and everything that can posibly ever been said about whoring has already been said.

Panda sighs in exasperation

For gods sake, some one please grow a set, and stand up against the whores. Everyone apparently doesn't whore, everyone apparently condems the whores, but out of the public eye pretty much everyone is a whore. So please, BoabyWanKenobi, ScipitaRourke, Deimne, Aurora, Iota, PedroRourke and Rhuarc, if you don't like your members whoring, do something about it, otherwise at least have the decency to come into the streets and tell us that whoring is OK, so we can finally lay this hideously repetative rant to rest...

Panda throws his hands in the air in a sign of resignation and barely controlled anger and storms off.

HEAR HEAR!

Michael applauds Panda in his exasperative moment.

Couldn't of said it better myself.

Lets out a jolly laugh and walks down the street.

I think there is more to this conversation then what has been said. Yes now you have a boat load of CL's meaning there is more housing available than the number of bodies walking our shores. But that doesn't mean we undercut our values to stoop so low. What do I mean by that, its one thing if your Made Men go down to the docks to offer the new blood a cup of tea, a beer at the bar over a pep talk. But the nuts and bolts that are Member Whoring are Crew Leaders that are sending unsolicited invites to the first person they see.

Now is it good business to just absorb anyone and everyone? I guess for a low life CL that prides himself on feasting on the blood of his own every 7 days. I guess some just need alternative way's to stay competitive. But for those men that actually have some honor left in this world, they will actually have a Conversation with the potential recruit. Why? Because do you really want an idiot working for you? Some would say yes its good business because he's either a feast dinner or a bomb earner/hitter. But what if he's a screw up? You really wanna have the next Clipper associated with your crew? Is there no longer honor abound in our part of the woods? Is business all that's left?

Am I saying no to business and the glory of numbers behind a CL, of course not. But ask yourself this question, how good does a CL look when one of his men fall to the obits more often than someone else's. Yea it might have been good for business because you got to use your rusted gun. But what of perception, self respect and values of the Cosa Nostra.

And the end of the day, those that choose to do Business will pay for the practices that they institute and instill within their organizations. Many a men have fallen from grace not because they were lesser men (perhaps they were), but because they lacked the capacity to earn respect in our part of the world. Its all pretty when you have a 50 member crew with Unsolicited invites and you get the opportunity to scrape off a few every couple of days. But when that one idiot does something wrong, mind you the rest of the community takes note. And as soon as that "what the heck its Business (whoring)" goes bad, that 50 man crew starts to pale in comparison to the Respect, Integrity & Honor the other men/women here walk around with...eventually enforcing it!

I'm sorry Fatality, I'm about...

panda checks his watch

42 days old now as a gangster. When I arrived on these shores I was greated with a similar debate on the merits and downfalls of whoring. The guys who where whoring 6 weeks ago are still doimng so. The families that endorse the whoring on the QT are still doing so, and I'm still waiting for the idiots to whither and die like I was promised.

Does it look bad when you have Inac gangsters dying every week? Yes
Does it look bad when people in the coffee shops laugh and point at cities such as [Censored - You know who you are!] and say that all its CLs are whoring? Yes
Have any of these whores and their Families died for bringing shame on this thing of ours? No, No, No, No, No, No.

So what if my family looks weak, cos I whore and I kill those whored members when they go inac. who cares if you think my gun is rusty cos I only shoot inacs in my own family. Fact of the matter is I'm training my gun, and I'm a CL, and I don't really give a flying fuck about you or anyone else, cos me and all my friends are holed up in our city of Indulgent Whoring having a good old time and shooting at pretty much everything that moves.

Honour in this thing of ours died a long time ago, and only its faded shadow remains. Sure if I call you a retarded dogs dick in the street, you'll go to my CL and ask I be punished or you'll shoot me because I have apparently dishonoured you, but you will sit back and scratch your impressively hairy hole whilst I whore perspective members out from underneath you fill the graveyards with their bodies when I need my blood fix.

There is no longer any point in discussing the whores, we either need to shoot the fuckers between the eyes and reclaim our honor, or admit that it was flushed down the Pan like so much panda Shit and move on with our lives and let the whoremasters whore their members.

Now that "The Honoured Society" has done enough work to get the mythical gods of our world to alter a person's abilities (giving them a disability, if you will!) when killing a -48 member of our world, they can turn their attention to a new topic.

I'd like to respectfully suggest the subject of acceptable recruitment practices be something they take a serious look at.

I'm pretty sure I've typed these words before, but anyone that knows me knows that I cannot stand whoring. I don't just mean unsolicitied invites - the worst kind of course - I mean "us" approaching gangsters, thugs and civilians, full stop. I include CLs, RHs, LHs, and sponsors in "us".

I won't go into detail, except to say that this is something that has been discussed between the cities. However, due to the nature of the problem, it's something that may take time until a path can be found that is agreeable to everyone involved.

This is a by-product of the fact we have so many families in competition. However, the number of families isn't going to change so, to me, our recruitment methods must... if it's an issue that is going to be put to bed.

I do not support the outright direct contact of 'Would you like to join our crew?' approach. At best, I can tolerate a sponsor striking up a conversation with a potential associate and getting to know them a bit before handing out an invite. Not everyone will be a good fit for your specific crew and might go as far as to bring a bad name to your city. This isn't always the case, however I do believe that one should take the the time to get to know someone first before throwing out an invite left and right. Even if it's a short conversation it's still a good start to see where the potential associate is coming from and why they want to get a start in the life of organized crime.

I also think that we as Crew leaders and even as far up as Godfathers should never be the ones to be making first contact with the civilian or petty thief. That's not to say if they approach a Crew leader or Right/Left hand first that we shouldn't be responding back to them, but we shouldn't be blindly searching them out. Afterall, isn't that what the sponsors are for anyway? Sponsors are there to free up the leaders to conduct other other business that is specific to their cities and nation as a whole. Why would you appoint someone the ability to be a sponsor if you as a leader are just going to take over that job anyway? If we're going to allow the practice of head hunting, shouldn't it be the sponsors responsibility to strike up the conversations first?

In a perfect world, the fresh civilians and petty thieves would be making first contact with the appropriate people and telling them what they can do for the specific organization. Not the other way around. I realize times have changed from what our ancestors were used to, but we shouldn't compromise our cities just to get as many bodies as possible.

I have never been one for random invites, even approaching a mobsters on the street is almost pitaful. A lot of times families will offer help, a point in the right direction.. and most often a invite just happens to come into the picture.

It is up to the crew leader, rhm and lhm to stick to their principles, and grow slow if they must if that is what it takes. Your family is important, take more time to get to know them, and less time on the streets talking to criminals who arnt connected, some of these kids need to find things out for themself.

"For gods sake, some one please grow a set, and stand up against the
whores. Everyone apparently doesn't whore, everyone apparently condems
the whores, but out of the public eye pretty much everyone is a whore.
So please, BoabyWanKenobi, ScipitaRourke, Deimne, Aurora, Iota,
PedroRourke and Rhuarc, if you don't like your members whoring, do
something about it, otherwise at least have the decency to come into
the streets and tell us that whoring is OK, so we can finally lay this
hideously repetative rant to rest..."

I think this may be one of the finest comments on this topic I've ever read.

While the positives of member whoring have been outlined here, and believe me, I understand how it can be beneficial to a family...

At the end of the day, a large majority of people openly condemn this kind of practice, yet nothing is ever done about it.

I'm tired of the same old rhetoric on this topic, and would like to see something done to put this controversy to rest. I've done my part, as many others have in the past, by re-hashing this topic and speaking out against it. I'm sure most are thinking of the phrase "beating a dead horse" when it comes to member whoring, but clearly this horse isn't dead when you see so many people coming out and sharing passionate view points about it.

An attempted agreement across the godfathers was attempted post my rant some time ago but it has not happened yet and may never will. That's the reality of it.

What are you people talking about?

There is no such thing as whoring going on, as far as I was aware these people are just "helping".

It is quite disgusting however, that I see sponsors walking around who have "helped" 8 associates and out of those 8 only 1 is alive, apparently they're not "helping" them well enough.

Now, i'm quite late to a dinner party I had arranged with a couple of petty thieves, please excuse me.

The problem with this issue is not that everyone thinks it's ok, but that the people that do think it is ok are not shown otherwise. Being told is fine, but words carry very little weight when it comes to changing actions of people, generally action has to be taken for that.

The Leaders whom are against Member whoring, through nessesicty to keep up, must Member whore. If you eliminate those who DO member whore, then you have nothing to keep up with, and the problem is solved. Back in the "Old days" we saw bold suits die for such behavior, and they only do not now due to the peace and calm that we have kept going for so long now.

Member whoring, In my opinion, is a punishable action. People whom Member whore should be punished, if they are not, then what is to stop them doing it? Harsh words and repeated rants? Show me a Rant without following action that has changed this world and I'll eat Birday's ass. (I see the jokes coming already, but you get the point).

This is just my view of this issue, but who cares, Im a lowly Wise guy. The people who can change this, if they choose to, are the Godfathers and Leaders of this world.

- Leo