A lot of work goes into attempting to identify potential rogue agents before they become active. Then the manner of dealing with them seems to be pretty clear. They get shot, simply put. Or an innocent gets shot. Myself, I've always wanted to do things differently.

I'm not saying shooting them doesn't work, though the result is a grumpy child that now wants your head as well as whoever their original target was. But then you're dammed if you do and you're dammed if you don't, as allowing a rogue to fester and grow in your ranks will result in awkward conversations with the cities of the people they slay. 

My family's approach has always been to create an engaging environment where such minded individuals are discouraged from breaking away and causing havoc. The theory was if they enjoy the company of the people they're working with or have no reason to turn rogue, they wouldn't. Well that was grandfather Jack's approach and he ended up getting shot on Christmas Eve by some jumped up little punk with no respect or integrity. 

So, given that lesson learned, how to do things differently without doing it the same as everyone else?

Well when someone is identified as 'skimming a little off the top' of their abilities with a gun, my solution would be to drop them. 40 day Wise Guy or not, they're still an associate. They would receive a letter advising that we appreciate their efforts however their services are no longer required and they should immediately seek work elsewhere. They would have their gun removed for security and ejected out into the world.

It's a little sloppy, and runs the risk of repercussions, but who is going to hire a suspicious looking unsponsored Wise Guy, really. You're also well within your right to drop someone for submitting fraudulent reports, lying or wasting your time training them, responding to questions while they feign stupidity. I'd rather spend my time and effort on someone who is actually fresh off the boat.

Or maybe we hold guns from everyone unless specifically advised by them that they are training their shooting skills? Why wouldn't you? What kind of organisation wouldn't track who has got a gun in their pocket, not just if they can use it?

As I say, I've never thought of the lethal approach before. Repeated incidents close to home have turned my head, however. One thing is certain though, I welcome everyone with the same benefit of the doubt, regardless of their history. I can't say the same thing after that trust is broken.

Drooling on himself Rick struggles to follow the point that’s Connie is trying to make. Confused by the fact that she’s actively encouraging turning on family members across the seven cities he’s profoundly caught off guard. Pulling a bottle of alcohol out of his lab coat he takes a fifth to the face like a fucking boss.

”Why not simply accept that you can’t control others actions? All you can do is show respect to your members and set the expectation that they respect you. Until you wear the rank of Made Man you don’t technically have a voice. Though not having your button doesn’t mean you should be discounted when voicing your opinion. Additionally, even after earning Made Man, crew leaders shouldn’t be held responsible for rogues unless they have knowledge of the plan. Determining a members life on their ancestors decisions is dangerous.”

Burrrrroing and drooling on himself Rick struggles to stay standing in the same spot. Moving around a little to wake his legs up he continues where he left off.

”This world has a toxic culture in the sense of holding kin responsible for their parents actions. Which in turn continues to breed more and more rogues from what I’ve seen. Yet when some are given a fair chance and the past is buried some flourish. I’m not saying to forget history but forgiveness brings great peace especially internally. I would encourage people to realize that no matter how hard we try, we won’t make everyone happy. Rogues will be part of our world and all we can do is band together when they show their ugly faces.”

Stepping out from the crowd, Siren reaches over and snatches the bottle of alcohol from Rick takes a hit for courage, and hands the bottle back to him followed by a wink.

The beauty of the current situation is the significant diversity from city to city, with each being ran independently and having their own micro-culture.  But with that comes inconsistency and chaos, which is the breeding ground for disgruntled players and potentially, rogues.  When a new crew leader is authorized, do they really have the experience for the role?  And are they given any true expectations?

Awhile back, there was discussion about having a Godfather Council.  Personally, I believe that is a wonderful idea.  Establishing a hierarchy with standard expectations of behavior from city to city would be the first step.  Not micro management, but sharing a common respect between leaders. 

Example:   Right now, there is a belief that someone should provide a post justifying their reasoning for taking down a city.  I totally disagree with that as it typically just turns into a "bitch" session.  But what I would like to see is that after the deed is done, an explanation, out of respect to the other leaders, be provided in the Godfather Council meeting.  Then it's up to the cities leader to decide what he/she wants to share, knowing he/she was provided the privileged information out of respect.

So to make the changes that Connie has presented, it would require some type of consistency from the community in whole and a certain level of respect from city leader to city leader to have unified expectations.  What keeps other crew leaders from picking up the dropped player?  Respect and fear.  If that respect is broken, then there is no doubt the other leaders would be more than willing to step in and assist in resolving the situation, essentially removing those that don't fall in line.

Looking back at Rick and that bottle of alcohol Siren wonders what the hell was in there as she issss fffeeeelllliiiinnnggggg vvveerrryyy dddrrrruuunnnkkkk...................

Glaring at Siren and contemplating some portal experiments Rick looks up at her while letting the brief instinct of rage slip by. Realizing that he has plenty more alcohol he struggles to keep together his own thoughts while listening to Sirens opinion.

”I won’t give a decisive answer on if I’d want a Godfather council. However, I will give a decisive answer in that I strongly oppose treating any kin negatively based on their parents actions. People make mistakes, people get in disagreements and most of all people in this dimension will die. All of us realistically will die at some point. There’s infinite realities though so we got that going for us.”

Burrrrping and drooling a bit down his chin Rick quickly wipes away the mess. Scrounging through his pockets for notes he had taken previously from months past he finds something topic worthy.

”So I made note of this and I won’t go into detail. However, I do agree with Siren that explanation to the masses should no longer be an expectation. Especially when it involves inner city politics. Regardless of what is put out to anyone in regards to death there’s always multiple stories, forged documents and fake witnesses. People will always go off opinion instead of fact.”

”I fallback on that we shouldn’t let history write the future. Instead, we should attempt to build together regardless of the past.”

"I've always felt if I have someone in my ranks that I saw as a potential issue, then the burden falls upon me as the leader to either accept the risk they represent or to handle it in a permanent fashion.  It's not easy, but leadership isn't supposed to be easy.  It means making hard calls and sometimes pissing off entire bloodlines at you for generations to come - all in the name of keeping your family safe."

"To be fair, and so they can choose to go elsewhere if they don't like my policy, I make a point of letting everyone in the crew know (during recruitment & usually each week when I ask for reporting to happen) that I normally err on the side of 'handle it in a permanent fashion.'  I explain to them that I do this for both the protection of my city and my crew because the needs of the many ALWAYS come before the needs of the few/one in the families which are run by my bloodline."

"Sending a potential rogue out into the world means that I'm handing my problems off to another person.  The Don they join up with might not realize what I have realized, until after it's too late.  If I choose not to act on intelligence that I have a potential rogue in my ranks, I've given them a chance to continue growing & in the end, I'd still hold some of the responsibility for whatever blood they spill."

"Yes, it can make a bloodline salty if I get it wrong.  Most people, however, seem to understand that this is the cost of trying to protect everyone  - not just from rogues but from someone deciding to wipe our city over 'too many rogues.'  I suspect a lot fewer people will die from 'bad calls' on the part of a Don, than from successful rogue shots.  And we'll certainly spend a lot less pointless days & nights firing our guns hoping a rogue becomes unprotected right in front of us."

"Yes, there are bad Dons out there who might use the excuse of 'bad reporting' to lighten their roster of people they don't like ... but I think leaders who do that too often severely hinder their ability to recruit good/loyal people to their banner both in this lifetime and in lifetimes to come.  So I don't worry about that too much.  The truth about a leader's abilities will always out."

"Will I miss people?  Sure.  Sometimes I'll give the benefit of a doubt to the wrong person.  However, it's my hope that happens rarely enough that when it does occur most folks will weigh my successes against my failures and realize that this was just one of those shitty things that happen to us all at some point.  Ideally, they'll allow me to compensate the families of the fallen, and make things as right as possible for not catching my own problem children BEFORE they acted.  And, if they don't, if we die anyway because of a rogue's actions ... at least my crew and my city knew I did everything that was realistically possible to protect them."

Siren I agree with you that it's much easier to bring about change or adjust the way we do things when there is a united front. I'm open to any legitimate attempts to bring about change. For better of the world, for better of the people or even just to do things a little bit differently for a while.

@Risk I disagree with you on the negative treatment of kin who have acted out. A mistake or a shitty situation? Sure, within that scope there is potential for learning from mistakes and a different perspective to consider. A bloodline which consistently fucks with people and has knowingly broken trust to do so? Absolutely no chance. I've got no time for people that want to watch the world burn, over and over. 

There are a lot of people around these parts whose bloodline have never taken a rogue shot. Never switched sides or fabricated evidence. Never slipped a friend on the opposing side a tip off because they go "way back". Those people work hard to maintain their reputations and integrity so that others know them for that. A serial rogue will never earn my trust in that way.

And Mrs Byrne, I can't fault your approach, though it seems too black and white for me. That might just be me hanging onto my "Nobody gets left behind" morals, which contrasts quite vividly with "The needs of the many", despite how logical it may seem. In a situation where I am 100% certain of deceitful behavior, then yes, the trash must be expelled. However where there is doubt, where I can truthfully say that my suspicions are based on a hunch with only circumstantial evidence to support, I could justify ending a persons employment.

I still have my doubts, if that would ever be the right way. It is just difficult to call an alternative when the standard is to kill them.

Other than the rogue themselves, I do genuinely struggle on where to point the finger of blame for a rogue appearing because of the million and one reasons why they may choose to do that, whether it’s boredom, lack of progress, an agenda etc.  

Is the person to blame the crew leader who takes them in and gives them the chance?  

Is it the targets they have in mind for fostering the situation that leads to it?

Or is it the behind the scenes manipulators and pro wackers?  The ones who are quick to dip their hands in the pockets and contribute anonymously?

As the well worn phrase goes…as a group of people trying to stop it, we have to be lucky all the time.  They only have to be lucky once.

Listening to everyone give their opinion slouched over on the curb drooling on himself Rick struggles to stay conscious. The alcohol is really taking hold of him and it's a struggle to formulate thoughts in his head to follow along. He mistakenly drank the alcohol from Dimension 151. Luckily the alcohol from that dimension is specifically designed to allow for individuals to speak regardless of lack of brain or bodily function. Previously designed for sobriety checkpoints the loss of bodily function really causes issues during the reverse ABC's..... especially when you're shitting your pants...

"Isabella, I can respect walking the line on the more... cautious side. Though where is that line drawn? Reputation of the bloodline? Individuals coming to you offering to personally vouch they can't be trusted? Or does it take suspicious actions from said individual?"

Doing his best to wipe away the drool as to not come off anymore disrespectful than he already has Rick continues. 

"The reason for questioning your methods isn't to criticize or disrespect you. Instead it's to possibly learn and develop means for others to improve their processes as well."

Looking at Connie some of her words strike deep. Realizing the intention is not to offend but simply ones opinion he lets out a burrrrp he's been holding back. Attempting to continue to clean the drool off himself and his lab coat he looks at Connie... or he thinks he does but instead he's reached the point of going entirely cross eyed. Additionally he accidentally let out a shart....

"Connie, my bloodline has rogued. Multiple times actually though it's been decades since they last chose that path. However, my bloodline has also gotten Godfather multiple times. To make a finalized decision on someone regardless of repetitive behavior even seems drastic. I'm not justifying repeated rogue runs by individuals. Though I think condemning someones kin only causes the situation to be worse. I also realize some people do just want to watch the world burn. Those type of individuals cannot be reasoned with. Which would only further prove you can't blame crew leaders for others actions. This world is designed for individuals to be able to hide if they want. How can you blame a leader for someone/something they may have never known about?"

Trying to pull the eyes forward from the back of his head Rick realizes he's about to lose control of his bowels. Abruptly making an exit from the streets to the nearest phone booth Rick resorts to shitting everywhere in the booth. A fowl odor lingers and the thin glass walls are now covered in feces. Stumbling back out of the booth his shoes and the bottoms of his pants have small splatter marks of shit. 

"I've clearly had an... accident. So I'm going to go ahead and excuse myself. I do want to clarify that I don't support rogues in any fashion. In fact I've been known to want to go to extreme extents to try to kill them before they kill innocent individuals. However, bloodlining is a very very thin line and it should be treated with great caution."

Turning and running off Rick continues to shart down his pants and lab coat. Quickly realizing he never should have doubted the alcohol from dimension 151.... even he can't handle every type of alcohol.

So the concept of going incognito was also an option given to people that were encouraged to get a clean slate. In fact, depending on the leadership it is almost the only way to do so.  Would these people be considered trash? After all they are incognito too.

As far as the gun regulations go, I think that it could very well end up hindering crew leaders in times when they need to find a pro. I mean if you take all the guns from people not training them, would that not hurt the leadership more than anything?

While I can appreciate attempting to protect your own, I would have to ask at what cost does this come into play? At what cost are we looking at when war strikes? Does this not make it a little illogical?

Raki sat there in the background and listened to each one of them and instantly shook his head, trying to figure out why they would even consider discussing this, as if the problem could be solved right away, he agreed with a few of them on some points, and on other points of it he disagreed, where as rick had a huge point, and he leaned forward, and poked his head into the light.

"You know....I think you all have some valid points, but I think ricky is right...I wouldn't say you guys are wrong...but they way you guys are discribing it....isn't that being kind og biased? I mean if we all went based on ancestory...wouldn't we all be in trouble? because in all honesty...whether you want to admit it or not, I am sure one of your ancestors have rogued at some point or another, would you want to be judged based on that? or would you want to be given a fresh start?...cause think about it, if you made a decision today..and you kids, and whethere that decision is good or bad is all on you...but would you want your children to get judged based on what you did? no..because one that isn't fair...two it's in the past, and three you would want them to be given a fresh start..." He stated as he combed his hair our of his face."

"Now...So I get what you are saying Connie...but at the same time..if you were to drop that wiseguy like garbage...one...you aren't really taking care of the problem...you are just making it worse...because they could not only rogue but they could become a rogue crew leader...and grab followers, which would make them more powerful, if given enough money and enough followers...you can't just think that idea will work, or like isabella said...you if you did drop them and they went to another family and rogued...again someone else would be taken care of your problem...we can't just assume that everyone is a rogue either...just because they aren't active...or because they are training their gun, that alone is being biased. In all honesty...some rogues happen because they feel like they are making a point...or they were pushed into doing it..now I'm not promoting it...but I am saying that sometimes people do it to bring certain things to light...and they feel it's they only way they can bring justice...so like some other person said, everyone has their own reasons...it doesn't mean they will do it all time...and we shouldn't judge other's based on their history, because then if given the chance, you could be judged based on your ancestors past...so you might want to becareful on what you are saying and where you are going with this."

"Also...I agree with rick...if you guys do start to do this, this could be considered bloodlining...and although I don't support roguing out...I also don't support bloodlining..so maybe find another way to figure out how to stop rogues...as I said earlier....depending on the choices you make...could make potential rogues now...forcing their hand...and I don't think non of us want that..and maybe I am wrong..and maybe I sound like a madman...but I have seen discussions like this end badly because people are scared of too many rogues...or people being accused of  holding a bunch of rogues and that crew ends up getting killed..which isn't the case...but hey..what do I know...I am small capo, that has heard stories and studied my ancestories history."

He then bowed, and slid back into his seat, and keeping his mouth closed, looking at his boss as he shrugged, and leaned his chin on his fist.

Seraphyna thanks for your contribution, it gives me an opportunity to clarify "Incognito Trash". In this sense, I mean it as a singular term. If someone wishes to conceal their family line, I have no problem with this. It's those who are doing so for malicious intent that I take issue with. My line have never asked about the history of those they work with, even those placed into a leadership role. That's testament to the quality of individuals themselves, to be honest.

And Raki as far as blood-lining goes, I will trust those who I work with once, and only once. If an offspring of a known rogue approaches me for a clean slate and is looking for a chance to work with me, I will grant it. I do so because I strongly believe in showing them a different way of doing things. In the past my ancestors have preached this on many occasions to those who claim to be rejected because of their heritage. 

Unfortunately as we know kin can change, but behaviors rarely do. Such is the way of our world. If that one chance has been extinguished then I will have no desire to accommodate or waste time and resources for them any longer.

I admit the dropping approach has a few flaws and most likely isn't the best way of doing things, but it's a thought towards change and a chance to talk about it. Clearly the topic has already riled the blood of one person hiding among the ranks, following the events of yesterday. I've also had time to consider what I would make of a person who is up front, honest and engaged with our crew, however for whatever reason decides to break away to fulfill their own agenda, driven by external influence. 

A tyrannical crew leader they take specific dislike to, for example. I would have to look at that on an individual basis, as it does not sit into the same category as I had in mind when drafting this opinion, referring back to my comment on malicious intent. I also wouldn't suspect anyone who is honest, engaged and vocal to have that premeditated mindset. 

And no, Raki, my family line have never turned rogue.