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| So, To Auth A RHM | Started by: Fisk_Capizzi on Jan 30, '08 23:15 |
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"This is one topic I am eager to find the opinon of the public on, as it could solve many a problem and add a sense of survival and loyalty to the mafia underworld" Fisk removes his jacket and sits back on a bench outside of a local park, taking the time to admire the first few stars as they peer through the darkening skies. "In this day and age it has been tradition for when a family head bites the bullet and gets iced, the family disperses, being scattered into the other crime families across the states. "Now I know if I was a boss, I would like to die knowing my family continues on without me. I would leave someone the responsibility, preferably a Capizzi, but if not then one whom I know can be trusted and who understands the same aims and beliefes as I had for the family. "Let me cut this a bit shorter for you, as there is plenty of time for me to pour out my thoughts on this topic. "Loyalty to a family should be exactly what it states, your life dedicated to a signle name, a single cause. I would not crawl into another's crew just to stay alive should my Don fall, god forbid, when I was allowed to work within this organisation and then accepted as a Soldato I intended to die as one of them, as well as work with them. "Should the heads of the six families be in discussions regarding a law of right for the RHM to be able to set up a HQ should his boss fall? Should this be an automatic swtich? Would, in reality, a family fall to pieces at the death of their Don, their father, uncle, grandfather and Godfather?" |
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A law of right? We are law breakers, not law makers. We are an alternative to government structural rigidity. It amazes me when I see mafiosi try to act a legislature. Anyhow, none of this matters, because if a Boss dies, about 99% of the time his RHM dies with him, as he should. Even if he didn't, what sort of restraint can be imposed on the Boss who doesn't want to see that RHM in a bold suit? We have free will to act as we wish as human beings. No "law of right" can keep someone from shooting that guy in the head if they don't want him with a crew. |
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| Reply by: TheWeasel at Jan 30, '08 23:24 | |
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"Signore you forget there are several laws we tend to uphold ourselves. such as the 48 hour for new arrivals. "And anyway, that doesn't matter, because if the powers that be decide to make it a law for all mafioso to follow then there is nothing you nor I can do about it. "You do bring up a good point regarding the RHM dying with his boss, and probably any other high ranking members, but are the bonds of a family so weak, the idea of loyalty so lost that the outsiders, even soldatos would simply run and hide than fight and probably die? Would they not even prove those bonds of friendship and loyalty within that family and fight those who strike down their superiors?" |
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| Reply by: Fisk_Capizzi at Jan 30, '08 23:29 | |
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That is a whole other issue. I believe that a loyal mafioso should fight after the death of his Boss, but that doesn't guarantee that he will come out alive even if successful in striking down the enemy. "Death before dishonour" is a phrase that comes to mind. Some things are more important than the survival of one person, and one of those things is to leave a legacy as a brave soldato, not someone who ran with tail tucked. A coward dies a thousand deaths. A soldier dies but once. |
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| Reply by: TheWeasel at Jan 30, '08 23:38 | |
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"Hmm, indeed, words I strongly agree with. "Would you say then that it should be common practice for all members of a family to fight back against those who take down the high rankers of their family, rather than filter away into other crews? "Because that raises the problem of fighting off those seeking to bag an unsponserd mafioso during a time when they are struggling most" |
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| Reply by: Fisk_Capizzi at Jan 30, '08 23:41 | |
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Zig-Zag interjects. Lads, if I may, I think Fisk is on to something here. I know that my great grand father (Many times over, have lost count) when his father perished as a crew leader, bore witness to his father's right hand take the reigns of the family, and then he himself become the right hand. Now, I also know that my Grand father, The_Mathmatician was right hand to a one Saosin, whom perished, and then The_Mathmatician took the reigns. At none of these times were any of those men considered rogue, and at none of these times those men were authed in that position. I believe it's just the course of action for the Right Hand, whom takes rule over the family in the condition of a Leader being away, to take rule over the family in the condition of a leader perishing. That is how it should be. I would love to see the leaders make that their ruling. But then comes the question of right hands whom aren't even of Made status yet. What happens to them? To answer my own question, I dare say that if a crewleader is in the position to make an associate their Right hand, they should be gambling away the survival of their family--not saying the person isn't right for the position because skill surpasses all rank, work shows rank--just saying that if the right hand can't purchase a headquarters while the hq of old burns, that is the risk those families take. |
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| Reply by: Zig-Zag at Jan 31, '08 00:42 | |
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As I already implied, there is nothing stopping any RHM from taking over the crew of his deceased Boss. The tricky part is convincing the person who shot his Boss not to shoot him, as well. Get past that part, and then you have to convince others tha What you are proposing is a universal rule of applicability, regardless of the individual circumstances. It isn't going to happen. |
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| Reply by: TheWeasel at Jan 31, '08 00:48 | |
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And why not? You say it isn't, but you're not saying that you don't think it should. What is your opinion on the matter? My opinion is that it should happen, and that if the leaders didn't believe the right hand was of a desirable integrity, that one would then war that leader as well. What's so wrong with that? We've seen leaders hand over the reigns of their family to their right hand before--my leader being one of which whom received that opportunity--and that has worked fine. |
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| Reply by: Zig-Zag at Jan 31, '08 00:51 | |
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Sorry about getting cut off there in mid sentence. Damn birds distracted me. I was saying that this RHM would also have to convince other leaders that he is more deserving than someone else who might have his eye on that city. The problem here is you are trying to disregard the human capacity to make free choices. You just can't say that a RHM should ALWAYS be allowed to take over a family. What if the most powerful mafia Boss in the country doesn't want that guy running a family. Is he supposed to sulk off to his corner and live with it? The world just doesn't work that way. |
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| Reply by: TheWeasel at Jan 31, '08 00:51 | |
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Zig Zag, there are so many things wrong with this that it is exasperating that I even have to explain it. First of all, the time you are referring to was one of disorder. There was no such thing as auth or a council. It was a free for all and a daily bloodbath. That time is a stain in our history. It's not how La Cosa Nostra works. We are not first and foremost murderers. Like I was saying, there is nothing stopping a RHM, if he somehow miraculously is allowed to live after his Boss is killed, from buying an HQ and taking in his former brothers and sisters. Just like there is nothing stopping someone else from shooting him. |
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| Reply by: TheWeasel at Jan 31, '08 00:55 | |
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| You're right, Mr. Weasel, it doesn't, in that case that boss would then war the newly authed crewleader, which is how it's always been done anyway. We've seen new auths get murdered because of peoples distaste for them in the recent past, why is it so hard to believe that we will see it again, anyway? | |
| Reply by: Zig-Zag at Jan 31, '08 00:55 | |
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It seems that we are assuming that any man who decides to take the life of a crew leader will have a reason to slay his Right Hand also. If his goal is simply destruction of that family, then so be it, but if he holds problems with the Crew leader alone, why should he turn his gun on the Right hand? The actions of the family are a result of the crew leaders decisions. It is a different matter entirely if the right hand wishes to reap vengeance. |
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| Reply by: Fisk_Capizzi at Jan 31, '08 00:57 | |
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What RHM wouldn't try to avenge his Boss? There is the answer to your question and the reason why a RHM always falls with his Boss. |
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| Reply by: TheWeasel at Jan 31, '08 01:00 | |
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| Indeed, that is a no brainer, but what I am trying to get to the bottom of is what happens should the Right Hand survive? Is it classed as successfully defending his family and he is allowed to set up? | |
| Reply by: Fisk_Capizzi at Jan 31, '08 01:04 | |
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| That's something we agree on Mr. Weasel. You're not worth your salt if you don't avenge your Boss. | |
| Reply by: Zig-Zag at Jan 31, '08 01:04 | |
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Not throw a wreach into this wonderful descusion Lads. But what if said RHM was the one that took down their own family Don for family survival. Maybe the Don wants to retire. Should the family then have to air out their own laundry in the streets or simple take their chances that no other Mob boss jumps the gun and says that their family is now a rogue one?? |
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| Reply by: Lilly at Jan 31, '08 02:12 | |
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NO. HELL NO! NUH UH! NOOOOOOOOO! Bad idea. BAD FREAKING IDEA! Christ, how would new blood ever rise to the top? Ever? When you receive the honour of auth, you choose your RHM. Do you pick the highest ranked person to join you? No. Do you pick the most experienced person who joins you? No. Nepotism wins out, you pick the person whom you trust the most, the person whose bloodline goes back a long way with yours. That makes perfect sense, you are putting the lives of your family in his hands, of course you want someone you can trust. 99.99% of the time, the son of the newly deceased family head would then join the former RHM's new family... and become the RHM. The only way to break that cycle is to ensure that CL and RHM die. MOST of the time, when a CL dies it is as a result of another family, or a person, not liking the way that family is being run. Why would anyone kill the leader, then leave someone that is also responsible for the running of that family to set up on their own? While it would be lovely to be assured of the CL's spot, or at least an RHMs job for your family for all eternity, it's a shockingly bad idea for anyone that isn't a part of the systes at the moment. |
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| Reply by: Anthony_Scotto at Jan 31, '08 05:19 | |
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A slightly wide eyed and startled Fisk looks at the new man to the conversation and thinks he should switch to decaf "I don't believe any new blood would rise to the top of a family if it's dead. If theres no family, members have got to start all over again in another family, or die.. You bring up a good point though" "And, in the event that the RHM decides to kill his/her boss, well that answers itself. It all depends how the rest of the crew feels" |
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| Reply by: Fisk_Capizzi at Jan 31, '08 08:21 | |
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I think it really depends upon the strength of the family and the strength of the RHM. I will use the Godmother of Philly to illustrate this point. She had a very strong family, with several Dons waiting in the wings, one being Ulysses. Had she have died and Ulysses setup to house her fallen members, would we be here telling him he couldn't do that? Probably not as he was strong enough to pull such a manoeuvre off. Now let's consider that a new leader dies and their Made Man second in command sets up. Would he survive the night? I very much doubt he would last the next few minutes. This can be easily arranged by any leader, a point the Gods made in times gone by when this came to their attention. If the RHM has the trust and respect of the family and the strength to carry it off, why shouldn't he setup? Anthony makes a valid point, which is probably why the Gods haven't made this mandatory. However, should a leader wish to make provisions should they have an untimely accident, then, well, that is their prerogative. |
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| Reply by: a1capon3 at Jan 31, '08 08:23 | |
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