"If we intend to live long and prosper..."

Long life is a plague of this world, and shouldn't be looked to with hopeful eyes. One should set out goals when he enters this world, and accomplish them with efficiency and wisdom; or fall to the stagnant shitpile that many call home. Be progressive, or fall into the ranks of the clickmonkeys. The LAST thing I want is to be in Our Thing for a year and only have my high earnings to show for it.

"I think we can be much more efficient and prosperous if we try to get along with everybody."

You're right. When everyone in the world is content with never being near the top of the totem pole, I guess we are more efficient. More prosperous. More sheepish. If you are here to live an honorable life, die an honorable death, and never cross anyone, I suppose we would be more prosperous. But I guess that just makes us equivalent to mine workers, wouldn't it? Do our best, bring home the money, and hope some day you don't get shot in the face for something for which you weren't even responsible.

"while at the same time avoiding stagnation since power is being shared and evreybody is building up at their own pace and with their own style without stepping on anybody's toes."

That's contradictory. You don't avoid stagnation through a power commune. I wouldn't mind if you took the stance of "everyone be friends", but don't tell me it will put an end to stagnancy. That's horseshit.

"I know that this is an effective war tool, but considering the particular circumstances of this world, I really worry about people who are able and willing to pull this off. So many people say that one of the great things about MafiaReturns is that the sons of mobsters can carry on a friendship that can carry on through generations, so to consider the life of a single mobster more important than the friendship that can last generations is sad, in my opinion. (From your latest response)"

I'm more worried about the mind of a mobster who won't cross anyone to get what he wants. I'm not saying to cross everyone in your midst, but if you have to choose between four months of reluctantly being nice to everyone and being bold for what you want out of your life; I'd be more interested in the latter. That isn't a call to dishonor your boss or your friends, just don't let them keep you from what you want to accomplish.

(OOC: As to the "friendships" that would end over one account, that's fucking ridiculous. Anyone who isn't mature enough to understand that this is a game, and the people playing it are just role-playing mobsters shouldn't be allowed to play. If you are actually *hurt* when someone ends your account, don't sign back up. You can be sad, but know it had nothing to do with your OOC ties, and such ties shouldn't be formed if you put such emphasis on the life of your character.)

To be honest, the idea of losing someone's OOC friendship should never be a part of making a decision.

Smiling as she takes a flower from a passing gentleman she smiles.

As an associate I generally keep what I say quiet polite and concise whe talking to people.   Why? simple coz I want whats best for my future and know is a time and place to open my mouth, listen and what reflects best on me and the family I am associated with.

My thoughts outside business e.g talking to friends outside my family can be playful and informal but never disrepectful.  I have watched some people start with a loud mouth and others get made and suddenly see how far the line can be pushed but at the end of the day we can look back on things with regret, glee or fear for what we have said whether in temper, misunderstanding or drunkeness but five minutes of harsh words can end our lives.  Even the harshest words can be said carefully, or thats what i think.

smiles as she watches a rat get squashed in the road and walks back towards the main road

Hastur, thank you for your well thought out reply. You certainly gave me a lot to think about and to respond to.

I agree with you that old age in itself shouldn't be the goal. But in a year one can also accumulate other things without being a crew leader, like the trust of the leaders, being an important figure within the crew even if you're not a hand and you can also accumulate a lot of kills to help defend your family to the best f your ability.

You didn't say it, but the way you worded this comment makes me think you like short and rapid cycles which means people dying often. I'm not suggesting stagnation, but isn't there a scenario where we are all happy with the way things are run and we could have 8 Godfathers and around 24 Crew Leaders on top of that and not feel the need to stab each other in the back and go around killing each other?

You mention being in the top of the totem pole. Again, I refer to my previous question... Can't we say we have 8 poles? Do we ALL have to be on top of the pole? Aren't there a whole bunch of people happy with being the second piece of it (whatever they are called)? If we had 8 Godfathers, 24 Crew LEaders, 24 Right Hand Men and 24 Left Hand Men on top of Sub Crew Leaders and Hit Squad leaders, adding to the people who don't really like leading and enjoy being regular members, don't we have enough room for all?

Not having a desire to kill any that is stronger than me means I'm a sheep? So it's not enough for me to want to have more kills than you, more Bodyguards than you and more rank than you? I must want to kill you?

"You don't avoid stagnation through a power commune." Agreed, but you don't create it either. Having a GodFather Council should lead inevitably to stagnation. I thought this was about power and money, not about bloodshed. I can sleep at peace knowing there are people as powerful as me if I can have a feeling that we are not about to rip each other's throats. Of course, my bloodline is also known for being always betrayed and killed in his sleep so I am open to debate this opinion of mine.

I'm not saying I won't cross anybody to get what I want. I am saying, however, that I don't need to cross anybody to get what I wan. If all I want is to impress my bosses to a point where I am given important roles within the city, who do I need to piss off to achieve that? If I ever get a crew and my Godfather sent me off to rule a city, all I would want is to lead a prosperous and active city where we all make loads of money and train every possible skill we have. That doesn't mean I will have to go around levelling cities to achieve it.

(OOC: I have never been killed by somebody who was already a friend. However, two very important accounts of mine were killed by people that approached me pretending to be friends just to turn around and stab me in the back. When you start talking about OOC stuff and you start thinking you have a bond, then that guy shoots your account and then rushes into your IRC room to make fun of you... maybe even rushes into your IRC room when your next account is killed to make fun of you again and keep bringing up the fact he backstabbed you in the past and relishes it... I think that's a messed up thing to do and it makes me wonder how that person is in real life. If the guy talks to me in the weeks prior to him shooting my account and then never talks to me again, then I have to conclude he only talked to me to betray me. If we had always stayed in character, it would be one thing. But people here put in hundreds of hours into their accounts and to have people kill each other over paranoia or pure bloodlust... yeah, you're right. I've said many times I'm not really fit for a mafia game and many times I wonder what the fuck I'm still doing here...)