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| As The Pickle Sees It. | Started by: Branston on Aug 07, '08 20:30 |
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Again, wanting to slap down some probably unwanted knowledge onto the table, but lacking the creativity or originality to come up with my own opener, I will once more completely steal FlyingPig's. Ty for being so considerate man, you're a right saint. A few complaints have been directed at the Leaders recently due to the number of unsponsored deaths after DaKine died. On the surface, this seems to be quite a legitimate complaint. After all, shooting tagged unsponsored mobsters after the fall of a Crewleader is an underhanded practise to say the least; particularly when explicit instructions have been given by a Leader not to shoot these tagged unsponsored. Needless to say the Leaders themselves have come under a bit of fire, not literally of course, for not punishing these ne'er do wells. Well actually, no, anyone who thinks all of the above to be true can hush right up. For a start, there will always be the odd chancer who takes a shot at a tagged after an announcement has been made, if that chancer wants to take the chance then that's his prerogative; you can't put down the actions of one wild card as a failure on the Leaders' behalf, can you? In this instance, then, you have to chalk any deaths up to bad luck and get on with it. Secondly, even if every leader bar one announces they will punish their members who are caught shooting at tagged mobsters, that doesn't mean the remaining leader is obliged to follow suit. It is the remaining leader's right to declare open season on unsponsoreds of any variety; just as it is the other leader's right to refute this and rain destruction down upon the first leader. So any tagged members who have been shot by a member who's leader has not made this an infraction is a legal kill. In this instance, you have no right to dispute a Crewleader's ruling unless you're their peer, so you shut the fuck up and get on with it. A common occurrence is where whining little morons complain about unbridled slaughter of tagged mobsters before an announcement has even been made. Wait a minute, you're saying people in the Mafia are a not very nice bunch of people who take advantage of situations for their and their families gain?! Say it ain't so, Sam! Now, if you are the sort of wet wipe who complains when this happens because it didn't happen in the last war, you can just shut the fuck up and face the wall right now. I hope you stand in poo as well. This is La Cosa Nostra, not a courtroom. You cannot plead a case because a precedent has been set before. There is only a precedent if the Leaders decide there is a precedent. Finally though, unsponsoreds will die because of the foolishness of their former family mates. Let's use the DaKine, well I'm not sure if I should call this a war, a takedown or an absolute fuck up, as an example. A couple of leaders publicly declared there to be not shooting of tagged members, at least not by their families. As you'd expect, this was not adhered one hundred percent, but I'd say it was given reasonable attention. Suddenly, though, a rogue leader sets up and tagged unsponsoreds, DaKine's ex members that is, begin to go down in droves. Can you see a correlation there? Can you think why that might be? If not, I shall explain. A rogue leader, obviously, is to be regarded as a threat. For leaders and their enforcers, two goals are of absolute paramount importance; containing the threat, and removing the threat. To prevent former members from rallying around this rogue, i.e to contain the threat, they had to be dealt with in a pre emptive manner. Unfair? Most probably, but life has a knack of not being fair at all, sadly. Even to someone who is still embittered and distraught over their loved one's death; it is easy to see how removing all potential threats before they become a problem is the most logical, sensible and safe thing to do from a Leader's point of view. So, next time you are in a position to set up without authorisation to avenge your Leader's death, remember that you act like a beacon to all of your former members; and you could inadvertently cause the deaths of scores of your fellow family, no matter how noble your intentions. Bringing on the Tang, as ever. |
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Actually, I'd like to raise a point if I may, Mr. Branston. Wouldn't this whole topic be voided if the war was carried out with any planning or tact and the first targets to fall were above Made Man rather than the Earners that were killed? And while I don't support the whole act of roguing full-heartedly, isn't it also true that several crewleaders stated their opposition to tagged members below Earner being killed but they were anyway long before Corleone Jr. went rogue? And of course you are 100% right in once the rogue went for it, chances couldn't be taken on remaining unsponsoreds. However, isn't it a possibility that seeing several of his own former crewmates fall while unsponsoreds after DaKine's death sparked the rogue? I know not ALL leaders were for letting them live, but shouldn't the call on whether they lived or died following DaKine's death been LargeHamster's call as he started the war? And wasn't his position that none of them should die Earner and below following said leader's death? I'm not sure as it's been awhile, but I thought the attacker got to set the limits, that could just be me though. If that's not the case then disregard those questions, but surely the sloppiness of the war and its maintenance after the fall of DaKine is more to blame for the rogue than anything else, no? Just a few questions I think should be posed for the opposite end of the spectrum. |
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| Reply by: MrWho at Aug 07, '08 21:19 | |
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As I said in my original speech, MrWho, "well I'm not sure if I should call this a war, a takedown or an absolute fuck up" Though perhaps not the most tactful way of putting things, I like to think I fairly well expressed my distate with the logistical side of things last night. No offense to LargeHamster of course, we all have to plan our first takedown at some point and it could've ended a lot worse. Nonetheless, I'm not afraid to say that, yes, it could have gone a lot better. Neverthless, that's a debate for another day as there was a rogue and the situation wasn't avoided. Such is life. As I've already said, there will always be chancers and idiots who disobey the wishes of their leader for some illicit kills; and not all leaders publicly agreed to the safelisting of the tagged chaps. As it was the choice of some leaders not to publicly condem the killings, it could've been LargeHamster's choice to enforce his policy nationwide; however, it seems as though he didn't. Of course you're right, the sole factor that allowed a rogue to set up was the fact that members who could do so were left alive, a mistake in anybody's book. However, it's not who's fault the rogue was, the factors and reasons for the rogue, or the legitimacy (never is for a rogue if you ask me) that the rogue had; it's the issue that, unquestionably, more unsponsoreds fell in a shorter time frame once the rogue had set up. This was not coincidence, and something I urge would-be avengers to take into consideration in the future. |
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| Reply by: Branston at Aug 07, '08 21:34 | |
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MrWho, as this has been stated, three earners had been killed prior to Corleone had set up his home. As Mr. Branston stated, wild cards will be exactly that wild, people fall regardless of announcements it happens every war or take down or fuck up, whatever you declare it as. Yet the same complaints are made the precious day as history has shown us. People fall it happens, it's the Mafia. You can't control what you can't catch can you? Once he setup, people began to join Corleone to assist in his endeavors. Some, even after given the chance to live with another Family, bought out to help on his behalf. Once the trend began, all threats had to be removed. Why risk another 48 hours of pro's and chases? He didn't setup to retaliate against former members being slaughtered, he was given a chance himself in another Family in which he was informed he would have to take a demotion to do so, a common practice in events such as those. He declined to accept it and was released, he made his choice and by doing so, caused the death of many others who may not have needed to die. |
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| Reply by: StonedSilent at Aug 07, '08 21:35 | |
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StonedSilent, I completely agree with you that the people from DaKine's crew had to be taken out after the rogue hit, thus why I replied to the dear Mr. Branston: "And of course you are 100% right in once the rogue went for it, chances couldn't be taken on remaining unsponsoreds." I guess this brings another issue to light though. I understand why people are angry about the rogue, hell I don't like staying up to follow them around and figure out pro times as much as the next guy, BUT... Where is the outrage towards LargeHamster? His fouled up war single-handedly put all the other families at risk by virtue of the rogue that sprung up following DaKine's death. I mean don't get me wrong, the whole "war" had a total anti-American Revolutionary War tactic in mind, you know, instead of shooting at the officers first they shot at the Earners. I don't know, it just seems that there is a blatant undermining of policy and crew safety from the leaders these days in the express hope to maintain status quo. Someone just let a rogue squeak out and word one was not said about it. It's embarrassing. |
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| Reply by: MrWho at Aug 07, '08 21:49 | |
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