The idea brought up by Frank-Big-Feet is pretty simple, it consists of getting jailed for 5 minutes if you get caught pickpocketing a CA.

During discussion other suggestions came up such as increasing the jail time to 10 minutes to maintain uniformity on the jail sentences and increasing the CA's pp defense a bit considering that they are too easily pickpocketed.

It was also pointed out that most likely officers would just give the person a beating, or perhaps take some cash back and that home city should be taken in consideration.


This thread is now open for discussion

My personal view on this is that first, we need to have a certain randomness into PP. Once your PP skills are trained, you never fail, this seems extremely not logical and unrealistic to me, specially regarding officers.

Officers who are obviously trained professionals would eventually catch people constantly pickpocketing them.

I agree with jail sentences, I believe 10 minutes is a fair amount, after all, is not that hard to get out of jails these days.

Secondly, I do think that we should have several different turn outs, just like wackback, you have several possibilities. One thing that I would add in is homecity and also the fact that some people own a CA. If you have an officer working for you (own an CA), and you pickpocket an officer from your own city, your officer could put in a good word for you and they would let it slide.

Now if you are pickpocketing an officer from another city or you don't own an officer, I would add in repeated offenses. This could be based on the same officer, or officers from a same family. First offense, they beat you up and let you walk. Second time, they put you in jail for 5 minutes, third time they take your money and give you a longer sentence. Last sentence could even be a modified mug.

In regards to the officers from home city that idea does seem logical. I agree that if an officer is in the same home city you are from that they would be more inclined to let you off the hook. If you own an officer he would put a good word for you. However he can't say anything to the other city officers so it would be a jurisdiction thing.

Repeated offenses do sound fair but wouldn't exactly bring in the randomness you are looking for if you ask me. Maybe it could be pure chance of which punishment follows if you are of course in the scenario where you are seen by the officer. enkindle's thoughts on where the officer would be in certain moods would bring in the random part you would like to see added.

I'm also for officers getting harder to pickpocket as you have stated that they would indeed be trained well if the art noticing their surroundings. {Giving the officers a bigger boost as far as I can guess the stat would be defense or defence. The different turn out for pickpocketing could be sort of mirrored from wack itself.} Jail for 5 minutes, Jail for 10 minutes, Mugging that affects your timer and takes the cash back, even when you critical wackback you can go to jail for upwards of 20+ Minutes.

We seem to be moving away from the initial point of jailing into a full on discussion about pickpocketing in general so I will continue on that theme.

Officers are too easy to pickpocket, in jails they have 6 guards so at a minimum they should be on a par with that game rank.

Pickpocketing in general, we probably need the old 1%er throwing in so your professionals do get a chance of something happening. {I would be for increasing this from 1% to something closer to 25%. The reason for this most people now days PP to get an idea of the level of peoples bodyguards they do this by PPing someone they know at a BG level and then trying people they don't know which gives them a rough idea. Throwing in a 25% chance of failing and suddenly your sample size to be sure increase quite dramatically, the person whose BG level you are trying to work out will suddenly get an idea they are being checked if Grin is PPing them 10 15 times to get an idea and can react accordingly}

CAs

I am a fan of home city chaps taking it easy on you, I would say if you have 2 CAs then there is a higher chance they would than if you have 1. But the boost would only come if you had a CA to vouch for you. I would however taper that the more you get caught because realistically your CA is not going to take the risk if you are PPing his mates on an hourly basis. You could potentially link that in to what he kicks up to you with a penalty if you are caught to often.

Punishment

5 mins in jail

10 mins in jail

Added time to flight

Mugging

All of the above are good, however I think the benefits of pping need to be looked at as well. I am not sure a CA is going to be carrying a lot of cash on them, however they could very easily be carrying drugs on them so getting drugs would be good which would be immediately sold at the rate. You could also throw in that if you are jailed for 10 mins or mugged you lose drugs you are carrying.

I understand the motivation for introducing the PPback-like feature when attempting to pickpocket a CA.
From the RP point of view all arguments stated above - about CA's training, etc - are valid and I agree with them.
I also like the idea of increasing the punishment basing on the number of failed attempts.

My biggest concern is, however, the punishment should be somehow proportional to potential benefits.
If we allow CAs to mug back and take your money and timer away, a successful PP should bring more than just $100.
In this context, I really like El_Nino's idea. Throwing in a few drug units into CA's pockets that can be stolen on a successful attempt sounds fair.

If this goes in then I think the officers vision will need to be changed, because as it is very few people stealth officers and it will just put people off even trying.

Secondly this should have some sort of bearing on rank, if a Don dips his fingers in an corrupt officers pocket then he isn't likely to do anything except maybe wet himself. And remember these officer are corrupt so maybe they shouldn't do any kind of retaliation to people from the same city so the pick pocket is more of way of fleecing the officers.

Personally in regards to El_Nino's suggestion on people failing at PPing, I believe that percent should go up via base answers. Stealth less likely to be caught, Defense harder to mug back or something of the sorts. This way that % is off your base.

Though I do think CA's should be harder to PP. I like the idea in regards to pping in the homecity of the CA and getting caught. Five minutes the first jail sentence is good and so on. So far this idea is shaping well.

(I think we should focus on the original idea in regards of CA's though.)

I believe I would settle on this idea for making CA's a tad harder to PP, or simple adding a certain level of randomness into pickpocketing in general.

I also believe I would add in that CA's from your family/city would be less likely to put into jail, they would let you walk more often then not, if they do catch you once in a while, they would jail you for 5 minutes. However CA's from other cities would pick harder on you, they would put you in jail for about 10 minutes and sometimes perhaps take some cash back.


{Guys, can we give this priority, we need to reach a consensus on the idea and put it up for vote, since this idea has been here for a while}

Well I don't think we will reach a consensus on this one, considering this has been here for a while and no other addition have been made to this discussion, there so I'll open vote just for the original idea itself.

If users then feel that it would be a good idea to improve on this particular matter, then can send another suggestion idea for us to look at.

Votes will be open now.

Seems a pretty straight forward idea to me.

I'm in agreement.