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| My Two Cents: Is Nothing Everything? | Started by: Mask on Sep 06, '08 20:31 |
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As others have already suggested, nothing is not everything.....nice slogan perhaps, but it's wrong. Granted, you perhaps have temporary refuge from the funeral parlour, but does it matter? If your family choose the path of continual early death and spewing of the "same garbage", will anyone really listen? Yes, they will hear you, but will they listen? No. You may have certain freedom to say what you like, but there are always consequences. You can add lack of credibility to the lack of cash, lack of respect and lack of fear. To me, it defeats the purpose of this thing of ours. You may as well stay on the boat for the journey back east. Undoubtedly, you are free of the stresses that can beseige a hard working, dedicated mafioso who has worked his back side off for what he has, but I know who will be the most satisfied at the end of the night when his head hits the pillow. If you are happy to plod along with no highs, no lows and just indifference to keep you company, then I suppose it might just be everything. For me, the highs of working hard and earning the respect of my fellow mafioso overcome any fear I may have about losing it all....by far. I would rather have had it all and lost it, than had nothing at all. |
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| Reply by: Caligula at Sep 08, '08 05:31 | |
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| I much prefer "I would rather have had it all and lost it, than had nothing at all." to the very depressing "Nothing is everything." | |
| Reply by: -Leo- at Sep 08, '08 05:37 | |
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I prefer: Freedom's just another word for nothin' left to lose Nothin' ain't nothin', Lord, but's it's free Although it is kind of long for a slogan. |
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| Reply by: Taskmaster at Sep 08, '08 11:14 | |
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Mask, Its been said, we come into this life... alive & we leave this thing of ours in a body bag. During this life, we strive to earn respect from our leaders and our fellow associates. We make money for the family that you have pledged your life too, and also ourselves. We make friendships, and meet the friends of our fathers and mothers. Some friendships can be traced among bloodlines so far back into the Old Country. Where loyalty comes in many forms for friends, and most of all family. and at times them friends and families do fall in death. with this said, how is this life invain in how we do things? |
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| Reply by: Rizzo_The_Rat at Sep 08, '08 14:40 | |
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| So long as theres love..... | |
| Reply by: Kal_Paradise at Sep 08, '08 14:47 | |
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| So long as theres love..... | |
| Reply by: Kal_Paradise at Sep 08, '08 14:47 | |
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That's one perspective, Leo. I would ask you to consider this, though: in addition to having power, prestige and money, the Godfather also has the kind of responsibility that some people do not want. I have no long-term ambitions to be in charge of a family. Finding my place within the existing family, and being of service as best I can ... that's enough for me. Of course, we will often hear people say that kind of thing, but not mean it. They may privately harbor ambitions to act satisfied until they have the opportunity to lash out. But if they succeed at that, what do they get? Cash, glory, respect etc. That's what they wanted and that's what they got. But now they have to watch out for people exactly like them. Money is nice to have, but loyalty is priceless. Is it even possible to factor that into our equations? |
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| Reply by: timoteo_boccatorta at Sep 08, '08 15:34 | |
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| A clarification: my post above is in response to what Leo said on page 1 of this thread. I apologize for any confusion I may have caused. | |
| Reply by: timoteo_boccatorta at Sep 08, '08 15:36 | |
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Caligula (who's above me in my family) wrote this: "For me, the highs of working hard and earning the respect of my fellow mafioso overcome any fear I may have about losing it all..." I like the part about "respect", though as we all know there are at least two ways to get what people call respect. One is through fear, and the other ... well, it's harder to describe. Perhaps an example is in order. I respect Caligula because I see a sharp brain at work — a good organizer, with an organized mind. We see lots of people who can look busy but don't actually get anything done. Yet a born organizer is well suited as a leader; when they work hard, things happen. Good organizers also tend to have contingency plans, because they've learned that (to paraphrase Von Clausewitz) long-term strategies rarely survive contact with the enemy. If I "respect" somebody because I fear them, I can't do my best. But if I respect them because I see their higher qualities, then a two-way loyalty can be born and then thrive. There's no question in my mind that if the money should run out and the parties end, I'd rather be on the side of somebody I respect for what they are. They'll continue to have my loyalty, which might not be the case with somebody I "respect" because of what they have, or can do to me. |
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| Reply by: timoteo_boccatorta at Sep 08, '08 15:49 | |
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My family has been around for generations, well before I can recall, and I am here to tell you not long ago, this was not the way. Members had respect for leaders because of both what they've done, and what their bloodline had done- which could be both good and bad. Now that's not me saying that no one has respect for leaders outside of the threat of harm, or perhaps I missed the mark entirely, but it seems to me things have changed this way. /PG |
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| Reply by: Phantom_Ghost at Sep 08, '08 18:56 | |
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| I think you're all gay and want me in bed. Just my opinion. ;) | |
| Reply by: Venom at Sep 08, '08 19:31 | |
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I disagree with Venom. Having said that, let me quote a post before that. > Members had respect for leaders because of both > what they've done, and what their bloodline had > done ... I am not too impressed by somebody because of what his father has done. Since we inherit half our DNA from the father and half from the mother, the genetic connection is a bit of a toss-up. What somebody's grandfather did is even less impressive to me; he or she will only have one quarter of that man's DNA. What can exert a stronger and more lasting influence than DNA is the family's culture. If a man's mother and father were both of like mind, then I can begin to be impressed by the family (not blood) line, because it's likely they passed on their values without contradiction. If he or she also has uncles and aunts of like mind, we've got a strong family culture indeed. But of course, with that kind of culture there's no objective need for DNA connection. That's a bias towards cooperation, true, but not a requirement. Being of the same mind is, in my opinion, more significant than being of the same genealogy. Considering that few of us here are actually related by blood, it's handy that it works out that way. It's the shared values that allows us to call ourselves "family", isn't it? |
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| Reply by: timoteo_boccatorta at Sep 09, '08 14:42 | |
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It's a subjective question. I can see some here arguing you claiming that nothing is, well, nothing. True enough at face value, but to stop there suggests a lack of imagination. Personally, I see beyond the obvious of what you're trying to say. You're nothing and though you hold no material possessions nor status in society, it is this lack that grants you a certain level of freedom over people like me. Except this is where your venture into the philosophical takes a wrong turn, and where the subjectivity comes in. You feel that your own lack of achievement means you are far more able than most to basically do as you please. Whilst this is a gross contravention of everything La Cosa Nostra stands for, you are basically right. You also assume that, say, the Made members of our society having worked harder, have paradoxically achieved a position of less freedom. That those who have worked for the rank will not want to lose it, and so mentally are less mentally able to exercise their free will. This is where you are wrong. Using myself an example, I am a Consigliere Leader. I have achieved a higher rank than any of my ancestors ever have, I held a captaincy for longer than any of my ancestors and now I have been given my own city, and I have held on to that longer than any of my ancestors. Sure, I have a long way to go before I am remembered by the masses after I'm gone, but I am still the most successful member of my bloodline, I still have a great deal further to fall. Does that mean I have less freedom than I did when I was a wee thug? Absolutely not. I will still speak my mind with just the same zeal and passion as my bloodline always have. And therein lies my point. If you are the sort of person for whom rank and reputation is everything, you will find rank less fulfilling; unable to exercise powers you've gained for fear of digging a hole for yourself. For those sorts of people, everything is nothing. They will never have anything whilst they live in fear. Nothing is not everything, nothing and everything are both notional concepts. Nothing and everything are whatever you make them. |
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| Reply by: Branston at Sep 09, '08 16:55 | |
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If I understood your point, Branston, then I agree with you. It can be a fine thing for me to reach a high rank, but if the rank is the sole source of my identity — to the point where it overwhelms all other considerations — then I have stopped living in freedom. Looking at it from a slightly different angle: no matter what I do in life — whether I be a Don or a street sweeper — there is a potential to find variety in my station. As I see it, death is not the sole enemy of life; inertia can stop the life pulsing within me just as effectively as a bullet. Perhaps this is why life on the edge is appealing to so many people: it promises an ongoing stimulus for adrenaline, which serves up a feeling of alive-ness. Yet if that's all they can foresee, perhaps they will end up trapped by inertia. That one-level kind of thinking could easily land them in jail, as they seek bigger and bigger thrills to pump up the excitement. I'm guessing that someone that inflexible would be incapable of rising to the level of Don, but they'd certainly shine brightly for a brief time. |
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| Reply by: timoteo_boccatorta at Sep 09, '08 17:43 | |
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timoteo, The "..." portion that you eloquently left out, was probably the most important part of my statement. |
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| Reply by: Phantom_Ghost at Sep 09, '08 19:32 | |
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| Nothing is nothing and if you put nothing into it you still have nothing. The moment you put forth effort, it becomes something. Something you you have done or strived to do. If you put enough effort then you begin to take pride in ownership. Once you own something you begin to maintina and monitor it for you want it to succeed. Once you suceed then it might stay or become nothing again as things change and it depends on your priorities if there are some. If none then you have nothing and your back at the beginning where nothing is nothing until you put something into it. | |
| Reply by: Narnia at Sep 09, '08 19:40 | |
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Well, this is a two-sided answer. It comes with both a yes and a no. I should know the most about doing nothing and I can firmly say that it grants you power. But, then again either does becoming something. If we are looking at this as a game, and not roleplaying at this point that is. Being Nothing It's shit. But, it's fun. You can get away with whatever you'd like. It grants you the power to not have to worry about death, because really, if you die... will you really actually care? The answer is no. You can come back millions of times and say whatever the fuck you want and do whatever the fuck you like. Is this really the point of this game though? No. It may be a power of sorts, but not the type of power that anyone should really strive for. (except me!) Being Something This is where you get to play the high and mighty. The only problem with this, is everyone wants this type of power, so it is hard to obtain and even harder to keep for a long period of time. You need friends, wits, and the ability to pretend like you give a fuck about the people who are above you (some call this respect). Or, you can take the easier route that some choose and suck as much dicks as you can... but this may lead to a salty taste in the mouth. Being a Don is a much different power than being a gangster, now you can say and do whatever the hell you'd like, but if you die then you're going to hear a much bigger thud on the way back to the bottom. But now (unlike as a gangster) people will actually care about what you say. If you are actually out there to play the game, then this is the power that you want and should care about. So in the end... i'd say that no, being nothing does not grant you the type of power you SHOULD want in a game like this. But it DOES give you the power to voice your opinion and not be bothered about that silly thing called death. |
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| Reply by: RevanIzLurking at Sep 10, '08 12:39 | |
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I realized that was way too serious... soooooo... OBLONG SHAPES ARE OBLONG. LOL. Okay, that's better. Ride in to the sunset on his pritteh horse. |
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| Reply by: RevanIzLurking at Sep 10, '08 12:42 | |
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| REVEN, SHUT YOUR FACE HOLE. AND YOUR HORSE IS UGLY. | |
| Reply by: The_Echo at Sep 10, '08 16:19 | |
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