I think it's just as easy to have this discussion without it getting heated or spiraling into a grammar battle, so it would be appreciated if Reaper Company members and prospects could start communicating their point a little more cordially.

It's very easy for words to be taken out of context on the Streets, especially when you're responding to several people asking different queries at once. However, the bottom line, in my eyes, is that there were genuine reasons for Ludarius ending Abbie. In fact, the kind of conspiracy described is a recurring reason for conflict on our shores, so I'm not sure why anyone would consider it any less acceptable or believable now.

For me, reading the "survival of the fittest" comment in context (in response to Ragnorak) does not water down the key reason for Abbie dying; although I admit, it could be taken the wrong way and "survival of the fittest" could be seen the underlying reason. I don't personally read it that way though. As always, perspective is everything.

I think the fact remains that the reason for this happening are contained within LudariusMom's original statement, but more clearly in Ludarius' follow-up statement.

Just one tangential comment for Ludarius:

"Truth is, Detroit can choose to explain everything or explain nothing at all. Its our option, its the city we have been given the opportunity to build and its certainly not mandatory we've to give an explanation for every affair that materializes in the Motor City."

No city or crew leader "must" do anything really. Managing public perception and informing your colleagues is a very important aspect to being a pillar of the community though. You might cop some backlash occasionally with the kind of disagreements or misinterpretations that have transpired here; but I wouldn't be quick to think those small negatives outweigh the positives of keeping people informed.

There are ways and means of doing anything in our world. Ludarius' organization could quite easily have come out here and announced that they killed Hoffman because they wanted to and that would have been well within the rules of the Detroit contest. Equally he could have adopted the Jerusalem approach and led with it being a contest and he's still alive and therefore winning it and that would have been within the rules too. However, neither would have been the right approach to reflect the operation within Detroit or how the leaders here view the contest they are in. We are taking this as a very serious opportunity to build families that will work their way into every little nook and cranny that this city has. That has probably resulted in far too little performing for the outside world in what was half supposed to be a circus of idiocy. We apologise for that but we need to do ourselves and out families justice.

That leads us to why AbbieHoffman was killed and why Ludarius' organization has come out here and offered an explanation for it. The families of Detroit are committed to working together to establish another stronghold for Cosa Nostra within our country that has for too long been lacking. When one of those new arrivals decides to take it upon themselves to disrupt the peace that we believe will facilitate our growth, then our options are limited on how to deal with that.

To pretend that you shouldn't protect yourself from a potential threat simply because it hasn't materialised yet is beyond naive. If we sit around waiting for that potential threat to be realised, the realisation will likely take the form of a bullet between our eyes. This is a cut throat business at times and I'd rather be the owner of the knife than the throat.

With that said, within Detroit we are committed to working with any leader who shares our ideals and beliefs on how this city should be run. That is why we have welcomed Revolve to the city with open arms and the other 3 families continue to work together to provide a stable and strong future for Detroit. The same can also be said to any potential bosses out there who would like to come to Detroit. This killing will hopefully be the anomaly rather than the norm.

Cory Chase was smoking a cigarette and listening in on the conversation of the events that taken place in Detroit. He nodded and paid close attention to know the history of what happened. He finally took some time to speak, throwing the cigarette off to the side.

"Donbot, I agree with a lot that you just said. This is the whole reason for an experiment, because that is exactly what it is. In a way it is like throwing test mice in an environmental atmopshere and seeing how things play out. These experiments are to learn from. In the experiment, you are free to do as you please and make any announcements that you see fit. You didn't have to come out here today and explain reasoning for the death, but you decided to shine some light on it anyway. I do hope Detroit finds a way to work peacefully within the city, seeing that you have the voting rules implied as it is. If the moment came, you could get rid of anyone you decided to vote out without going to bloodshed as the first option. There is a lot of different way this can be seen. I just wonder that if the CL's of the city wouldn't have wanted him there could have let him know that he was not welcome before he made the move. However, that is non of my concern. I will not question the elements of the experiment itself, because that is why it is in place. Working together is something important, but I know that all the people participating in Detroit know that.

Only thing I question that you said, Donbot, was 'To pretend that you shouldn't protect yourself from a potential threat simply because it hasn't materialised yet is beyond naive'. Some might see it naive to kill someone who is 'potentially' a threat. Like Spike said earlier, I don't think this man could have been something of a real harm to you right now. I feel that could be reversed to be seen as being paranoid in a way. Many rumors spead amongst this country and almost everyone could consider everybody else as a potential threat. Would be a bloodbath to base your decisions off a potential threat. If you can't get along and you thought he would be a cancer to the city, fine. But to kill someone just because they could do harm or have been rumored to do harm.... I have never been a fan of believing gossip as it comes to my front door, but some people are different about that. Klling someone because they are a potential threat, to me, can seem as sort of a low blow. I am a firm believer in giving chances and building for the future, and not the past or base judgement off what could be.

With that said, I wish you all in Detroit the best. Like Don Neon, I hope you guys can come to a peaceful way to do things. With all the peace that have been brought to our country as late, seeing a lot of bloodshed isn't something I see productive for the country. I hope you guys find the norm you are looking for. I do look forward to seeing what you guys can make the city into."

Let us make no mistake with this, AbbieHoffman had plans to kill another member of the Detroit hierarchy. He actively tried to have Revolve slain. Perhaps it was a poor choice of phrasing by me to classify it as a potential threat, because it was a very real one that simply lacked the capacity to follow through with those plans. This was not gossip and it wasn't simply Ludarius' organization operating on the belief of what might come to pass; it was a decision made on the basis of what was known known and what had been seen so far.

I find it difficult to believe that other leaders would have acted differently given the events that transpired. The evidence that Detroit's leadership have no intention of making this a bloodbath is demonstrated daily by the complete lack of it. These are three, now four, families that have been thrust together and are building a city out of the pieces they have been given. If we were to be operating on gossip, rumours or hypotheticals there would be no peace, prosperity or growth. That is why I think it is pretty evident that nobody within Detroit is acting with anything less than an appropriate mentality for the scenario in which we find ourselves.

"I am sorry if I came off a little strong. I wasn't trying to question your integrity, judgement, or anything of the sort. I admire that you guys, as a city, come forward with explainations. I could have just been rambling a bit from what all I have been listening to here today. If you have solid proof, I am not to question any judgement made on that decision. Or even if you didn't have solid proof frankly. I am actually surprised with the calmness of Detroit to this point, and it makes a good statement that people can work together without being best friends out the gate. You guys have the power to make this history however you wish, and that is the beauty of it."

Nothing at all to apologise for Cory and thank you for your kind words.

Although Abbie was from my crew Det made smart move and det should keep killing anyone who steps in det as CL

Eric drives past Donnie in his golf buggy. As he approaches Donnie he grabs his walking cane and smashes it round the back of Donnie's legs. Eric stops the buggy and grabs Donnie, throwing him into the passenger seat at the same time.

"Now, now Donnie. Just because you're a kill hungry bastard doesn't mean Detroit have to be."

While there Eric looks at LudariusCane and smirks.

"As you said, it's survival of the fittest, or what I prefer to say. Every Man or Woman for themselves. You had reason to believe Abbie was plotting, you removed that possibility. These kind of things are competitions yes, but with cities you have to do them properly. Just because you want to win doesn't mean you should shoot your way to winning. Yes that would work and be helpful.. but where's the sense of achievement then?"

Eric pauses to catch his breath.

"Working and building up a city with friends.. that's the way to do it. If you're connected you can go places in our way of life. Whether I agree with dismissing someone so quickly or not.. this is an experiment and competition. It will be played how it must and the entire reason for the 'No Interference from the outside' is to allow it to do just that."

Eric looks at Revolve.

"I'd also like to wish you the best of luck in Detroit. Ludarius, Wing and Tyrion have slowly built that city back to some kind of life. It's been dead for a very long time and it's nice to see some colour come back."

Donnie Laughs

I am not kill hungry bastard eric, i am just saying they did good move and that they should continue removing all newcomers. Current crew leaders in Detroit seems to trust each other and 4 crews is enough to build good city so anyone new gets bullet. Knowing few people in detroit i am sure they will build great city.

Eric smiles at Donnie, and pats him on the head.

"You're such a good little person. I am sure also they'll build a fine city but you also forget that the vote system should come into effect at some point. I'm not sure on the details of how that works but there will come a time when perhaps they'll need to vote one of their little band out."

Eric nods once more at Donnie and drives away in his golf buggy.

Our little band is making great tunes in Detroit.

Fiddler, hit it!

I's reckon it's good timing their boss!

Fiddler pulls out his fiddle, begans playing, and does a little dance

Eric looks behind him while driving away and notices Detroits little band having a boogie and smiles.

I just wanted to pick up on something mentioned by Cory;

I just wonder that if the CL's of the city wouldn't have wanted him there could have let him know that he was not welcome before he made the move.

Abbie was welcomed into the city, in fact, I actively encouraged him to make the move. However, at no time at all prior to the move taking place were any of the Detroit leaders made aware of any of the candidates of those in the next round of dice rolling. In fact, there was no talk of any movement at all with dice rolling in itself, no-one in Detroit was any the wiser as to whether or not there had even been any applicants.

Now i'm not saying thats a flaw in the system, I don't have any issue with not being told, we (Detroit leaders) are simply pawns in the experiment itself and aren't due any warning to the movements of who is or isn't going to set up shop beside us. But we cannot be expected to express any dislike for people that are coming, if we don't get told they are going to be coming.

That aside, I have nothing further to add to the discussion.

With all the tavern wenches Tyrion has banged, he's got quite the two step.