Marcus_Rossi stands in front of the gathering crowds ready to begin his speech. His nerves are going wild as to what sort of reaction he would get from what he was about to say. However, he would not be deterred, this particular matter had been eating away at him for some time and he had to get it out. It all started a couple of weeks ago when upon going through his old family home he found a diary which belonged to his Grandfather, Cruel, a Don Captain of Detroit. Flicking through the pages he found an interesting article that Cruel had written. An article that until now was kept under wraps and never shared. He could see why his Grandfather never released this article as at the time it could have looked very bad for him. Today Marcus wanted to share this with everyone...

Before i begin my speech i would like to point out that this debate is in no way intended to instigate an act in any way. To that end i will not be using any of our current names or cities. This is merely a debate that i would like to share with you and hear everyone's opinions on.

Joey was a crewleader in Manhattan, he was a Don and was a Captain of the Godfather Mickey. They had been friends and Joey had worked under Mickey for a long time. Joey however, was starting to get itchy feet, he felt he had done more than enough to become a Godfather but there was one problem. All the other cities had Godfather's too, including 'potential Godfathers'. Joey loved his Godfather to bits, Mickey had done everything for Joey, he gave him his opportunity and made him what he was. Joey appreciated this but his feet kept getting even more itchy. He felt it was his time to become the ultimate and one day he decided enough was enough. He wanted Godfather and he wanted it now! As he had been around for some time he had an extrememly strong family that were capable of doing some real damage.

One morning he woke up and decided the time had come. Assembling his finest hitters he told them of his plans and they decided to follow him. Joey and his family attacked Godfather Mickey and his family. After a long battle and plenty of bloodshed, Godfather Mickey eventually fell. Joey had done it, he had killed the Godfather and was now himself, Godfather of Manhattan.

Joey and his family went back to their Headquarters and built their defences. Manhattan had seen some real drama and Godfather Joey was anxious. He was unsure as to what the other city Godfather's would make of this. Would they see it as him taking the bull by the horns and showing great initiative? Or would they see a great act of betrayal and wipe Joey and his family out?....

This Ladies and Gentlemen is what i want to hear your opinions on. Obvously that was a story but a very realistic story of what could and probably eventually will happen.

If you was Joey what would you have done?

Did Joey get power hungry or was he taking the initiative?

What should the other city Godfather's do?

Would they even get involved? After all it's not their city so why should they care?

On the other hand how can the fellow Godfather's trust Joey after his great act of betrayal in killing his closest friend for his own benefit?

Now you can see why Cruel never bought up this subject, being in the same position as Joey it would have probably been looked at as conspiracy and maybe even ended up dead.

Everyone will have different views on this subject and i would like to hear your opinions. I would like to stress again that this is in no way trying instigate any type of act so plzdntkilmethx.

Marcus sat down and took out a notepad and pen, eagerly awaiting the people's feedback...

I have spoke about this before but it hasn't been widely accepted. That is, that a Godfather is not the leader of every family in a city. He is simply the most powerful family leader in a city who the others look to for approval and guidance in their affairs. Therefore, loyalty is not an issue. The exception, of course, is when a Godfather appoints a Captain - OUT OF HIS OWN FAMILY - and the Captain actually operates as a Captain. If the so-called "Captain" is not from the Godfather's family, he is not a Captain. Also, if the "Captain" is not paying tribute, he is not a Captain. We have alot of mobsters running around who are supposedly Captains, but who are indistinguishable from Bosses. Sorry if this is getting off topic. The point I am trying to make here is that loyalty is not an issue unless the "Joey" is a Captain, and "Joey" is only a Captain if he is from the Godfather's crew, pays tribute, and runs a very small family. (Traditionally, a caporegime has ten members).

Did Joey get power hungry? Sure he did, and there is nothing wrong with that. A mobster who does not desire power is a strange sort of creature.

Should the other city Godfathers be concerned or intervene? If they choose to do so. You can not make a blanket application to the situation. If they feel it is in their best interests to do so, they should do it. Maybe they are more comfortable with Joey at the helm than they were with Mickey. Maybe not. Maybe Joey is a retarded fuckstick who should never have been given auth by the incompetent Godfather Mickey in the first place. In that case, maybe someone should wipe that whole city off the map and let it rebuild under better leadership. It all depends on the circumstances. Every situation requires a different reaction.

I believe that as the Godfather was the one that gave that man his chance and he was in fact the only reason that person got to where he was, the Don commited the ultimate act of betrayal.

It is not a case of one thing or another though, as obviously this Don did take the initiative.. However, it was a complete and utterly disgraceful betrayal. 

The other Godfathers in this situation I would say should make sure they keep their friends close, and make sure that everyone they trust is actually someone they can trust. While the other city is not their concern as they run their own, I suppose the threat of that other Godfather may be too much to ignore. In this situation I suppose the best thing to do would be to build up defences, create a plan in case of attack so that if the new godfather should decide he wants another city, you have the best opportunity to defend yourself.

Though there is the other side of me, which would say that this person is completely untrustworthy and that perhaps while the person is weak and trying to recover from his last fight that he should be removed quickly and quietly.

It is all a matter of opinion I guess. If it was me in this position, and I was one of the other cities Godfathers I would stay wary of this person. I would have a real surge forward getting my people to improve their guns, and any sign of trouble from the new godfather and he would be dealt with.

AfroSamurai pauses to think for a second

If I was that Don, I would never have done that. I swore my life to my Boss, and if she chose to make me a captain of hers it would be the utmost honour. By shooting his Godfather he basically spat in his face, and told him that his captaincy wasn't good enough.

The Samurai bows to the man, and walks away whistling

Pres hears an interesting story in the streets and decides to invastigate. Upon hearing he mans views he answers the questions;

If you was Joey what would you have done?

I see myself as a patient person. If I was in that position I would bide my time and hopefully something would come up somewhere. I'd like to think I'd earned Godfather position by respect instead of taking it into my own hands. It all depends how much you trust you're Godfather I suppose.

Did Joey get power hungry or was he taking the initiative?

Joey got power hungry and bored. But I can see why others would think he was taking initiative however I personally don't have Sith like views so I'd say power hungry.

What should the other city Godfather's do?

There should be a meeting about it and maybe some rules in place for this kind of behaviour.

Would they even get involved? After all it's not their city so why should they care?

It may not be their city but GF's all work together in this thing of ours to try and keep the money flowing so I guess they would have every right to get involved.

On the other hand how can the fellow Godfather's trust Joey after his great act of betrayal in killing his closest friend for his own benefit?

Keep your friends close and your enemies closer. ;)

Thats my two cents but what do I know......

Alfie walking down the streets carrying his small bag after done doing some job he heard Marcus talking about an interesting subject

Nice speech you got Mr. Rossi well if you want to hear about my opinion here it goes

Alfie puts his bag down

in my personal opinion its nature if some gangster want to move up the rank and get known, hell we are mobster and if I can quote a famous gangster " If you not give, I'll take it ". I mean greed it runs through our veins what Joey did took out his Godfather make him a stronger man he is than his late Godfather and like Godfather Thomas and NY motto " Welcome to The Jungle " where only the strong ones survive, its simple the stronger beat the weaker.

Alfie pause for a second and reaches in to his pocket and pulls out his watch

Damn, I almost late kay then about the other Godfathers from outside their city they have to look this matter in business point of view. Like Lansky when he given the nod to take out Bugsy his long life friend. So if doing business with Joey is more profitable, why not? If not, they can always whack him everytime they want.

Alfie looks his watch again

Damn, I'm really late I got to go so good day for you all and sorry for my lack of english

The danger in allowing a guy like Joey to prosper and survive is the message it sends to the Captains in the other cities. It says, "Go ahead and wack your boss. If your successful, we'll accept you,"

With all due respect Mr. Cobb if the Godfather don't know its coming to him and let Joey emerge its all because his poor Judgement to people and lack of his information or due diligence

Sorry I forgot my bag

smiles

Jayne nods thoughtfully

"Well said, Mr Alfie,"

"In the words of Sir John Harington, 'Treason doth never prosper: what's the reason? Why, if it prosper, none call it treason,"

"We live in a world that lauds success, regardless of how that success is won. Treachury is a time honored tradition in this thing of ours. Which, of course, only makes truly loyal followers all the more precious and valuable,"