Without the usual spiel of lighting up a cigarette or standing on a soap box, I'll get straight to the point.

Scorched earth policy vs Protection orders.

Historically, we've been through periods where both of these policies have been in place. At times entire families were wiped and it didn't matter if you were a lowly Gangster or not, if you had a gun you were gone. In others, we have seen strict protection orders in place whereby Wise Guys and below have been placed on a safe list and allowed to continue their lives under a different crew.

The problem I have with protection orders these days is the risk involved around allowing former members of dead crews to live. When things seem to be settling you always get one silly Sally trying to keep the pot stirring. They probably believe they're doing the right thing and maybe they are, but it's a futile effort and only ends in the same result. The other problem I have is the rising amount of people who act as a Wise Guy these days but have potential to be so much more, why people choose to remain a wise guy I'm unsure but in moments of war we may see these pissants reach their true potential and cause severe damage. 

As you can probably tell by now, I lean more towards the side of the scorched earth policies. It minimises any risk towards the victorious family, there's no ranked guys left alive and there's no little minions to keep protecting them for hours on end. I mean, who recalls that shit cunt Credits? The guy who kept missing everyone but managed to stay alive for 24 hours pro'ing everyone? We all know how tedious it can be chasing down a rogue with an ample supply of pro wackers and the same can happen after a war, all it takes is one guy and we can find ourselves in trouble with the amount of Gangsters and Goombas who can rally to their cause.

I don't disagree with the policy DoctorBoom has put in place today, it's probably the right thing to do. Much the same as it's probably the right thing for the rogue's who have been popping up to do what they're doing too. So where does it leave us? Do we continue with these Protection Orders? Leaving ourselves open to rogue shooters and other pissants? Or should every Tom, Dick and Barry be wiped off the face of the earth to ensure the protection of those most dear to us?

How about a middle ground?

"A what" I hear none of you cry.

Yes a middle ground.

Everyone considered an Earner and below survives. Above that, you die. This would both minimise risk and allow those who aren't quite there yet to stay alive and settle under a new family. I feel this would probably be the best of both worlds and would keep many of those who like to piss and whinge when everyone is wiped, somewhat happy. As victors we do the right thing by allowing the lower ranked guys to live, while eliminating the possibility of our opposition from creating a last stand.

What are your own thoughts?

mister chade what a lovely speech here comrade.

I'm of the idea as well that it should be scorched earth. No survivors. If I shot EVERY Made Man and above, I think that could suffice, but as you say, there are many wise guys out there intentionally sitting there with much potential to do damage. It's at that point, I'd just say scorched earth. One wiseguy whom would be normally 'protected' could have hundreds of notches on his gun while being virtually undetected. Such a shooter could aim his way through many bodyguards.

I'd say when there are enemy war combatants, such as today; Psychochef and KarmenKayne, I would begin the removal of all associates until they fell. I would not risk MY people to cater to the associates of the dead. MY organization(s) are far more important than preserving numbers of the enemy.

My family journals say much about the protection order policies, about how they usually work, but sometimes fail. We've seen many times important people break those orders without punishment. (Tom-Ford & Mibbit are two that I can remember that broke several protection orders but always evaded punishment due to their connections). A long time ago in my family line, my ancestors district was decimated in one quick wave. Almost everyone dead, but here he stands, my great great grandfather. He mailed one of the attackers, a man he assumed was a decent enough friend, Jake Luciano. He had asked Jake to protect several of his associates who were new to the world of crime and if not shown the proper way, may die off and no bloodline may return. The response was simple. "This is simple, it's a scorched earth policy, sorry". It was upsetting, truly, but I understood.

I do like the middle ground you present. That way, no one with a lot of potential could be sitting through wars as a wiseguy, casually biding their time with no loyalty at all towards their family. It would be bloody, and would probably turn a lot of people off, but I think the idea is in the right direction.

I say it's time for people to start acting like their rank. I saw a couple of fellas in the street today complaining about how their pappy or mother was innocent and killed unjustly. I just scoffed and kept to myself. Innocent.. No one is innocent in this life.

"Well said Chade."

"I personally believe that the protection orders given these days are good it keeps people within this thing of ours longer, however that being said it really doesn't matter whether you do protection or wipe a family. People will hold on to their beliefs of what is right or wrong and at some point will come back to perform a coup d'état or go rogue."

Madara takes time to walk into a well lit spot separating them self from the crowd. They look away momentarily to remove their mask without exposing their face, take a candy out of their pocket and pop it into their mouth before replacing the mask and turning to address the small gathering of people.

I personally favour a scorched Earth policy... Madara begins before taking a calming deep breath

Although, I don't favour it for the same reasons as stated by yourself, Chade 

If the reason for killing all or just any wise guy and above as you suggest for the middle ground compromise would be put into affect, it couldn't be to stop any remaining threats from receiving protection from lower ranks. 

Without being sponsored and thus given permission by an established crew leader to attempt to wack mobsters three ranks and higher as is forbidden by the Gods of the universe, any Made Man who might be considered a threat are reachable by ANY goomba and above. Thus instead of anyone earner and below it would have to be anyone gangster a below.

Then once you look at the fact that it takes only moments to join someone's family, request their blessing for authorisation to go making attempts on people's lives, the gangsters too are a threat. As are any thugs who're potentially about to become gangsters.

In this instance, where DoctorBoom has given out orders for protection of those left, it is because there are clearly no severe threats left. No mobsters who even if they would retaliate, can retaliate and cause any significant damage.

Whilst each style, the selective killings vs all out annihilation have their merits and purposes, I think a much greater problem is a mentality that IF you do not commit to being in a family, you stay wise guy and below and don't do anything to earn your bones you're safe. This is a BAD practice in my opinion. If a family has offered to sponsor you and you've been given protection from any would be assassins in training who other wise would have used you for target practice if you hadn't been sponsored by them, you ought to be expected to return the favour and fight and if needed die for that family.

There has been an increasingly common practice of "ship jumping" and for a society who's code prioritises honour and loyalty above all else, that is a diabolical practice to accept. 

Some say you shouldn't "blood line" a family line, but if a family is prone to going rogue and causing major problems for those who adopted them and gave them a home then you can't argue or frown upon others to be wary or even sceptical about allowing that bloodline into their family. The same I believe can be said for bloodlines who've repeatedly disappeared or joined the enemy at the last moments before or during a war. Only to watch people who had considered them friends and family, being murdered.

This is one of the reasons I am a fan of the idea of scorched Earth more often than not. It will instil the idea into people that no, you can't rat out and keep your life. No, you won't be elevated to positions and even offered families of your own just because you've lived a long enough life to have improved your marksmanship above the average and that if you want your family's name to hold respect for future generations you're going to have to show prove it to be honourable and worthy of trust.

Now, I'm not saying all take downs must be scorched Earth. I understand there are times when it is a select few individuals who're a threat or a problem and they must go, but there's no reason a few rotten apples must spoil the bunch. However, when there are large scale take downs and there's no leaders left standing, you show a lack of loyalty to your fallen comrades by then siding with the very people who murdered them.

Madara noticed there was a soapbox they could have been standing on to allow the people towards the back of the crowd to see them. They sighed wearily, stood on the soapbox and repeated their opinions so the iconic orange mask that had been passed down through generations could be seen. It didn't occur to Madara that the inanimate nature of the mask made their own visibility pointless.

Antonio, I hear what you're saying. People can still hold onto a grudge, but their ability to deal more damage is a lot less than that of a higher ranked mobster. There's only so much we can do, bloodlines will often come back with a vendetta and so there's always some element of risk there.

Madara, I'd like to keep things realistic. It's unlikely we're always going to see a dedicated hitter at the rank of Earner who can hit a Made Man or Capo. In these instances I'd say the risk is smaller and therefore manageable. In regards to the earlier protection order, there were still threats around, but I'm not here to dispute the protection order put up, I'm just correcting the point you made. 

Ship jumping is becoming more and more popular to the point it's now become the norm. The fact that people are investing more time and money into their own lives means they are more reluctant to see their lives end and so choose the easy way out, even by way of betrayal, in order to extend their lifespan. It's dispicable, but practical.

Pride has gone out of the window, as has honour. If creating a scorched earth policy would help diminish this way of thinking then I am even more for it.

Chade I didn't suggest that an earner (who could have had time to get 79 chump kills under their belt if they're really a dedicated hitter, by the way) would be need to be killed because THEY are the threat. I was pointing out that if the reason being given for killing wise guys and below is because they can give pro's to any made men enemies who've yet to be taken down, then you'd need to go ahead and do away with anyone regardless of their rank. 

"Chade I agree with you about the risks always being there.

I would just added that rank isn't all that important in a numbers game. If you have a organized group of hitters that can perform a surgical cut by eliminating all active hitters on the enemy then it is over. You can't fight without hitters. So the ranks that are left have zero to minimal gun experience. No threat.

Cerise has never had the chance to properly address someone on the busy Streets. It was far more preferable, as well as safer, to flit in amongst the various businesses on the outskirts. More interesting too, in recent recollection. However, the topic at hand was far too tempting to step away from without letting her view be known.

Et iz a wonderful mental exercise, to debate such things. Et iz known, though, that our words 'ave no sway when bandied about publicly. Our wise and respected leaders can do as they wish with the remnants of rival organizations,  as they see fit. Et may be in agreement with your views, may not.

She shrugs

I do not think 'hat any of you believe otherwise though. Et iz, as I say, a lovely mental exercise!

There are many recent and many older accounts of 'ow each city dealt with ze homeless. Some, killed everyone in zis "scorced earth" that extended to all associates. Others, only ze members who 'ad made their button or were active in gunfights. Et 'appens to be a policy zat I feel crew leaders take up depending on which makes their options more flexible, while keeping true to their own ethics. Overall, I think et iz better 'at not everyone follows the same way of doing things.

As for ze...ship hoppers? Et iz an unfortunate general shift of ethics. Zat is where I shall leave 'at potentially explosive topic.

Sasha listens as people have there say about the events of last night and the protection orders put in place.

Now the going down with the ship while it is noble and heart warming to watch at times. Is a futile gesture most of the time.

Now as it stands the 6 cities have seen alot of turmoil of the last few months most folk have lost many family members to the gangland violence that has plagued our streets of late. From what i see here DoctorBoom decided after removing the head of Detroit he would give the remainder a chance to find a safe haven if they wernt involved in fighting back.

Now that move can be a two sided blade on one side yes the folk can and as we seen do take the offer to live another day and also we see some who will sit look for like minded people shooting back and join the fray.

It has and will be a talking point as i see it your damned if you do and damned if you dont DoctorBooms job is to protect the city of Chicago a thing most people forget during wars or takedowns. If that means slaughtering every last one of the enemies in a city then i expect he will just do that.

But this time he decided on another approach, one i think could have just as easy came back to bite him on the ass by allowing most of the people to find a new home. And help rebuild the 6 cities a thing i think most people on here want to see as the time for rebuilding is about over due.

Agreed Sasha, it's difficult. On one hand after so much bloodshed in recent times, in DoctorBoom's position you are probably reluctant to go with a scorched earth policy. The last thing you want is for everyone to die when they have invested so much into their lives and especially while we're trying to rebuild, so I can see why he chose to be merciful. As much as people bandy about the word tyrant, I really doubt a tyrant would allow mobsters who had made their bones a chance at moving on and settling down elsewhere.

In a time where we're trying to rebuild it really is a difficult decision to make.

Cerise you're right, ultimately it's down to the guys on top. I can only hope that maybe some of them will stumble across our conversation and take an interest in it. I'd also like to know other peoples thoughts on it at the same time though.

Personally, I am for the scorched earth policy when it is a war.  If one side has already been taking out those that are Wise Guy and below I feel like they should continue to do so. This may seem a bit harsh but it then comes across as not picking favourite people to save. Instead those members chose their leaders. They had a choice out of all the cities to join and that was the one that they chose. They should die with it. Lord knows I would expect to had Chicago fallen instead regardless of my rank at the time.

LucaRossi walks towards the conversation with a soapbox in his hand and lays it down in front of the surrounding folk. As he steps on top of it, he takes out a cigar and lights it up. He starts the cigar up with his lighter before he gives his own opinion on the matter at hand.

"To me both policies have their reasons. However I personally think a middle ground is what should be done. 

As you put it there are tons of Wise Guys awaiting for their button and for whatever reason it may be. Either their Boss doesn't trust them or they are doing it for their own personal achievements. Or maybe the fact they know during wars most protection policies allow for Wise Guys to be safe listed. Whatever it may be, there are much more Wise Guys today than there has been in the past. And some of those can do some damage. 

I have to admit that I used to be behind the 'Wise Guy and below are safe listed' because they have yet to take the oath. They don't owe anyone anything, maybe their sponsor if anything. But as times changes, minds change. Maybe this middle ground could be the next idea of protection orders. But then if thats the case, what is stopping people from doing the work and just doing the same thing with the previous associate rank of Earner?"

I do think a middle ground needs to be in place. I don't think your idea is perfect but its definitely something in the right direction".

Luca takes a step off his soap box and continues to puff on his cigar as he awaits someone else to give their own thoughts.