This can branch into 18 different conversations when you say something like

The action is certainly not in the hands of those who have put in the time, effort, money, dedication, and patience to get into the positions they're in. The action is in the admin to change it if they don't like it.

We've seen 11 day old CLs, I think when people stop getting HANDED CL just for making an account or knowing someone, this last line might hold some clout. Until then it's the fictitious closing line of your novel.

If you wanna be fair about things, be fair all the fucking way around. NOBODY should have a right to ban an aspect of the game, it's unfair to the user base as a whole.

If people get "handed" crew leader it is because the rest of us let them.  You can kill anyone.  Hell, there is a completely different set of leaders... actually I think there had been like 4 major regime changes since mugging was put into place, and magically still several leaders do not like mugging.  Personally, I do not care... but I don't want to see my family members mugging other family members as that is a serious security issue.  If you don't like how things are being run in the game, you are supposed to build up and do something about it.  At least that is what the text that is sent to my phone every once in a while tells me. 

Instead of allowing this to really and truly be how the game functions, entire cities are punished by the game administration for playing the role that they fought and probably killed to achieve. 

We want to change a game feature and make it impossible to regulate, fine.. it is the administrations job to code the game how they see fit.  But punishing the customers for playing a game (without cheating) that many of them pay to play is just wrong, and it happens far too often.

We've seen 11 day old CLs, I think when people stop getting HANDED CL just for making an account or knowing someone, this last line might hold some clout. Until then it's the fictitious closing line of your novel.

Not all accounts are like that kdjkid. Point being, them running their crew is in their hands with their rules. Just because they don't like a feature or want there using it, doesn't mean everyone else will. You want to argue about who deserves auth and who doesn't? Make a thread.

If I have a family rules that says "No using the wack function, ever". As a CL, I should be able to make that rules. It's up to the others to follow it or not. No matter how crazy the rule might be, or frowned upon... They, as CLs, should be able to make their own rules as they see fit, regardless. That's the problem I have, which is much deeper than Izzy punishing cities because of a CLs choice of rules. I don't find either acceptable.

There doesn't need to be any quotations around handed, it is what it is, lets not tip toe around anything or make excuses for the userbase now. I would also expect family members to respect the wishes of other family members wouldn't you? People get mugged when they show disrespect and blatant disregard for another family members wishes. Honestly, who's in the wrong?

So those who enjoy playing the game in a casual way should just have features stripped from their use whenever anyone sees fit? So basically, if you don't put in 600 hours you can't enjoy the game in it's entirety because the "big boys" don't think you should.

No WE don't.

You want to argue about who deserves auth and who doesn't? Make a thread.

No, I wanted to kick dirt on your bogus statement that spoke of time, hard work, effort and dedication. Not a lot of that can be put in with 11 days at the kick off. Too much worth on CL in that statement judging by the userbases requirements of acquiring the position. THAT, was my problem with it.

I don't think anyone is telling you to put that much time into the game, that's your choice. But if you were a CL, wouldn't you like to make your own rules without restriction from admin? If you say no, I'll call you a liar.

I believe if a person was picking on another and taking advantage of a rule their family has in place, they can go to their leader and they should be able to handle it. That's part of the game. You obeying your leaders rules and approaching them if you have a problem and see if something can be fixed with it.

If not... Leave, switch families, go somewhere you can be happy. That's the reason you have your beliefs and they have theirs. Because not EVERY crew and district/city has that rule. Some do, but not all. I'm sure you can find a place that fit your beliefs just as much as the next person. That's why we are individuals who think differently, and do things differently. It's honestly the reason we play this game, because we appreciate some peoples opinions and the way they do things, others not so much.

If everyone went by the same rules and were expected to be the same person, we wouldn't have wars. We'd be fucking robots, on a one way path on how to behave.

No one is saying it's banned, because in realism, it's not lol. You still have the choice to push the mug button, and your CL has the choice to punish you if he has rules against it.

To be honest, he can do whatever the fuck he wants (but not really). If he wants to shoot you just because he doesn't like the MR name you chose, that's his choice.

No, I wanted to kick dirt on your bogus statement that spoke of time, hard work, effort and dedication. Not a lot of that can be put in with 11 days at the kick off. Too much worth on CL in that statement judging by the userbases requirements of acquiring the position. THAT, was my problem with it.

Well, if you wish to talk about my statement, my mailbox is open. Because there is certainly a lot more who have busted their ass over the ones who haven't. A fuck ton more. I'm always open to a willing convo and debate, and who know, I might see some points you have. But you're not providing any. There has been like 2 users I've seen recently that have got auth in the 11 day mark. What about the other 20? No one is telling you join that crew and sign their rules... That's all your power. Them being bold, the rules are their power.

That's the way the game SHOULD be. Choices, and repercussions. It applies to every little thing we do in this game.

Drunky, thats great. I support that line of thought, because its *your* decision to make for *your* character. You have the option to PP them, they have the option to mug you back, you have the option to escalate it further if you wish. I just want to preserve the options for players to make, rather than let the few disable features for the many.

There was a statement that said "build up and do something about it" unless you were alive for two years playing casually, there's not a damn thing you can do about anything without pouring in 600+ hours a year. Not if it would effect the experience of the game in a negative way, no I would not. I'm not talking for myself either, I'm talking for the "community". Basically if you try and take away features from a game you're just being a selfish (for lack of a better word) cunt. You don't care about how it effects the game or the userbase.

So basically, they slap you in the face 14 times and get a smack on the hand. You gotta bother your leader with pickpocketing claims because there's nothing you can do about it yourself?

There might be some CLs but not many that will let you take your account out of the city without a demotion or death of the account. Is it fair that I should lose my account or hard work because someones trying to all but eliminate my access to certain game features?

You're punishing someone for using a feature that defends themselves without any serious loss to anyones account. It's essentially banned.

The game is that way, someone made a choice and the repercussions rained down. To be honest, we should all be trying to do what's best for the game itself. Why we would pay to play or pour time into it and then try to limit it's features is beyond me. Sometimes as a player you need to step away from the self-centered BS and look at everything around you.

You can network, get a base together, work as a team.  again, anyone can be killed.  it only takes a month of somewhat lazy gun training to shoot the BGs of anyone in the game. 

I feel like a feature of the game is that Crew Leaders get to make the rules for their families.   By your logic doesn't that make anyone who would want to ban a crew leader from being able to do that a "selfish cunt"

Like I said before, there are pretty important strategic reasons why mugging shouldnt be allowed on fellow family members.  And as others have mentioned, there are perfectly reasonable role play reasons why even picking the pocket of another mafioso is completely ridiculous.  Why is your desire to be allowed to mug whomever and whenever you want more important than other people's desire to play the role of a mafia crew leader?

You call those people cunts, when they're really looking out for their families. Most people have the 'you can't mug your own city rule' because it makes sense. Even from an RP standpoint. Like Drunk said:

OK, so let's take it the next step in this roleplayed hypothetical. I'm a LHM. I pay my bills, in part, through money I get from taxes paid to the Godfather I work for. When my mobsters are hospitalized and can't run drugs, that affects me for two reasons: (1) because someone just hospitalized my close friend and business associate, and (2) by reducing my income.

Would it be appropriate for me to respond to the fact that my crewmember was hospitalized?

Thing is, you're caring to much about YOUSELF, than the rest of your family and how they make money, hitting, etc. It has nothing to do with taking the feature away from your family just because you don't care how it effects the game or the userbase lol. You wouldn't have a rule on it if you didn't give two fucks.  Also, if you're a casual player (because people spend WAY more then 600+ hours into accounts at times) then why the hell are you so worried? Chances are you won't be around enough and it won't effect you, rather then the people who do spend a little more time on this game then you.

A person who spends 24 hours on here, should have a slight edge. Not dominate, but slight edge. Or else there time on here doesn't mean shit. And if they don't spend time on here, MR makes no money. So yea, I don't agree with you. I don't think people making rules they think will benefits stheir districts/cities are considered cunts for doing so. It's what they think is best. And of they're cunts for that, then I would hate to see what everyone is.

So basically, they slap you in the face 14 times and get a smack on the hand. You gotta bother your leader with pickpocketing claims because there's nothing you can do about it yourself?

Yes, that's the way the mafia works. If you You check with someone on a higher scale then you , and they follow the rules that were placed upon them. That's the fucking mafia. Where CL's run their family, not the members, who could potentially get their CLs murdered for their actions. That's why they set rules in place.

It's pretty simple actually. Just because you're one of those people that doesn't spend much time on here, doesn't mean it needs to be adjusted for you.

Speaking of, where is all the support on this? I hardly see any. I guess the 'userbase' doesn't think the same way or this thread would be highly one sides. I don't see that though, so I guess it's not the 'userbase'.

You're punishing someone for using a feature that defends themselves without any serious loss to anyones account. It's essentially banned.

Serious loss in money. Which hinders the capital made for your family. If they didn't expand the timers for hours, then I'm sure there wouldn't me many restrictions on the mugging, but that's the code, not the userbase choice. So, as a CL, yes I like money. Yes I like my members to have free timers and able to donate. Yes, I like to play a mafia game where I control my crew because that's the way it works in the real mafia. Not someone who is a casual user that doesn't want to follow my rules. Like I said before, pick and choose from the million families set up, someone will let you. That's pretty much a given. Even the causal user can build a decent account nowadays so you much be thinking of... The users who only come around every so often out of the week, barely contributing anything. The ones who don't give a shit, unlike the CL.

But people are self centered for wanting to play the game they want, even from a CL position right? Man... they must be real cunts! Real naughty naughty cunts, lemme tell ya! Thinking of how to make their city better, expand, and make money for their members. You cunts!

You also never answered my question, just avoided it.

I don't think anyone is telling you to put that much time into the game, that's your choice. But if you were a CL, wouldn't you like to make your own rules without restriction from admin? If you say no, I'll call you a liar.

Let me ask this Izzy. Are you going to punish the first district/city/crew that wars someone over a mug that they have no control over? Could even be over someone new and learning the game, or a low rank just wanting to cause some trouble.

When someone dies from this because they can't make rules on it, how are you going to make it right?

You also don't rob high ranking members of the mafia either, at least not without expecting a bullet or a beat down. That's the way the mafia works, rank means something not just a bold suit.

and just because you spend 600 hours doesn't mean you can adjust the games features to your personal liking either...was there a point?

So is the userbase 8 members or what? Cause there's hardly 200 people in here going against what I'm saying or going for it.

When I played, I held my weight and more, usually top of the earnings and on the higher end of the families guns, usually top 3. Fact of the matter is I still considered myself "casual". Decent accounts don't get you a fucking thing though, not an ounce of nothing. So is there a point?

Fact of the matter is the casuals are needed just as much as the hardcores. So yeah, some things should "cater" them, just like they do to the other.

Your question was answered.

Not if it would effect the experience of the game in a negative way, no I would not. I'm not talking for myself either, I'm talking for the "community".

I would not wanna hurt the game or community by limiting features. How can the game expand when users are intent on limiting its effectiveness and features? This is about the fucking game itself, how is taking stuff away from the game good for it? There has to be a line in the sand somewhere. Otherwise we would apparently run this fucking thing into the center of the earth in a nosedive.  It's all about attracting and keeping interest.

I wouldn't put it past people, Izzy... When people can't come to common ground or don't agree, they use force. The only way they know how on MR. People are very protective over their members. If someone they're close to that has earned their rank, position, etc and is mugged, they will be upset with said person and said persons family because their CL doesn't control that.

Hell, I've even seen people stated 'PP friendly', mug. How are we suppose to control this if we aren't allowed to?

And even more hell, some people actually put in their profile "Mug me, and I shoot you."

So, I'm not crazy by bringing the death aspect of it up.

CL's are there to dictate their crew. I don't understand how you can dictate the CL and their rules? What is the point of running shit if your having to shit dictated by the admin? There really isn't any point from that point.

Sadly, the support is in my PM, a place safe from consequences from the very other side.  This is why there is support from a user on a new account, he can speak openly and honestly because there is no one holding a finger over the HQ wack button.  There is no fear of losing all the work you put in, because you don't think the same way as a crewleader. Many leaders are OK with being told they are wrong, some are not.  And the consequences of not knowing which are which, means the loss of your character.  There is nothing to gain by coming out here and supporting this publicly, and they know that their interests are being supported here via myself, and some others.

That's the point... It's the CLs choice and ability to do whatever they want while their peers watch and judge them. That's the way the game goes.... I don't get how the leaders are wrong in any kind of sense. According to the main statement of MR - They're allowed to do WHATEVER they like that isn't code restricted. Same with everyone else. If they wish to get bitter over a member OOC posting, that's on them. There are literally a ton of other crews to choose from that fit your wants in this game. 

Thing is, you say supported by yourself and via some others... If people were in support of this admin holding, then they would support it. The majority. Only thing I have seen is the majority HATE it. More then just you, said person, and the pm person.

Sigh.

Whatever, I've given many examples and reasons as to why I don't believed this is correct. I'm being shunned out by the minimal responses and reasons. I understand why, but it doesn't shadow over the fact the CLs should be able to make their own rules and decisions.

To be honest, I don't want Gohan to change his rule, whether it hurts our city or not in that department. I don't believe he should be dictated by the admin on how he wants to run his district. It's HIS run, not YOURS, or MINE. I honestly don't want to sit here and express my opinion for days, because I rarely do anyways. I've always supported your decisions for the most part Izzy and accepted them. I just can't agree with this one on any terms. So I hope you don't think I'm bickering for sake of bickering, I honestly care about this.

Part of the responsibility of being a crewleader is making tough decisions about how to deal with situations as they arise, not blanket banning features so they don't have to be bothered dealing with them.

I think you'd be surprised on how many times they have to deal with this situation even with rules in place over them. Even if the rule is district/city related. Several times actually. The rules on them are what cuts this drama down. So even with rules, they have to deal with headache. They're just trying to cut down on it... Nothing wrong with that, it's the way he wishes to run their city/district.

People mug each other from other cities regularly when the rules are broken. Keeping it to a city/district level should be theirs to decide. They also put rules on these so they don't have to babysit 24/7, instead of constantly dealing with people being mad over a broken rule. It's a simple rule, easy to read, easier to obey.

If you really must have a rule to stop problems from happening, here is one that would make 99% of the sane people happy:

1) Don't PP people unless you are man enough to accept the consequences of being mugged.

2) See number 1.

Most people do have that rule, from an outside their family/district/city wise. It's not like it was being ignored completely. There is more easy fix then punishing the whole game.... Don't join that crew, find another that suits you. If you don't agree with that CL and their rules, why the hell would you be with them anyway?

In this role played hypothetical I would probably be asking why the fuck your mobsters are out picking pocketing strangers? Don't they understand that it puts the family at risk? If they want to hone their craft why go out of their way to choose non safe targets?

And when that person comes back and says and complains that the person they stole from hit them? Well.. I would probably give them a firm smack and tell them that we don't employee pussies. If they have to practice their trade to stay sharp, tell them to mind their fucking targets, and the best ones are low risk with high reward, anything other than that is considered a "fuck you" to the family.

If you really must have a rule to stop problems from happening, here is one that would make 99% of the sane people happy: 1) Don't PP people unless you are man enough to accept the consequences of being mugged.