A short while ago, I decided to undertake an investigation into the state of the game.

I have now completed a report on MafiaReturns and this can be found for your reading pleasure, here.

Alternatively, if you would prefer, I am happy to email it to anyone upon request.

I hope that you take the time to read it, as it addressed many of the problems that I believe to be limiting the game. I have also included many viable solutions to these problems and would welcome a much wider discussion upon them.

I think we need to fix the game. Starting today.

~C~

Having already read, and given my thoughts, I would like to thank you for taking the time to express your views in such a lengthy manner.

I couldn't agree more with 99% of what you've said and I hope that many others actually take the time (you'll need plenty of this) to read it.

Again, your efforts are much appreciated by many in the user base.

...and in case anyone was wondering why I hadn't written the lastest Chuckle Knuckle, I actually have a legitimate reason this time!

~C~

Like Alabama I have already read this and a number of areas I am in agreement with, others I am not so and will post why later.

However I applaud Grin as the first person I have come across who has taken the time to think of the issues and approach them from a 'big picture' point of view as opposed to the quite selfish points of view I have observed in some of the threads to date.

I must also thank Grin for taking the time to put this impressive document together. I agree with the notion that this game is stagnating and I think this report highlights the biggest problems we are facing right now and also shows several excellent ways to make the game better and more enjoyable for everyone. I hope the admins take this into serious consideration.

...and in case anyone was wondering why I hadn't written the lastest Chuckle Knuckle, I actually have a legitimate reason this time!

~C~

Whatever dude, you will still be castrated.

...and in case anyone was wondering why I hadn't written the lastest Chuckle Knuckle, I actually have a legitimate reason this time!

~C~

No worries buddy, Sweeney's is miles better anyway.

Back on topic, this is a very good and thought provoking read. We all know to some extent that this game has run into some very damaging problems that do threaten to turn people away for good, which is a extremely worrying prospect for me as I absolutely love the game and would hate to see things deteriorate any further. This game should be enjoyable for everyone first and foremost and I think that this enjoyment is being endangered at the minute and should be remedied as quick as possible.

I'm very glad that you've published this report Chuckle, hopefully things will be changed for the better. Good job.

Grin I know I have been banging away at you to put this up but it was well worth the wait. I have said to you in private that I agree with everything you say.

I did play .org many moons ago but can't remember much about that format so can't comment on that, but it is true no one wants to have to work for a year to achieve something. We are lasting too long on accounts and ultimately nobody wants to step out of line because your going to have to go through 6 months work all over again.

Admins and Coders you do an amazing job on this game and the fact that people are still here trying to help by putting their thoughts forward to assist is a testiment to yourselves and the community that you have created. I hope that you all read this and offer you comments to Grin whether they be in private or here in this thread.

To Grin great work and thank you for spending the time to put this all together.

Again, Having had the pleasure of having a sneak peek at the report, I can only stand by what others and indeed I had mentioned to you.

First off, you should be commended for giving such a well thought out and thorough analysis of what we hold here. Any new members having a look at this should see the lengths of which this game can mean to people. Being done under times of exams, which may sculpt your immediate and long term future can only enhance the work you have done here.

I hope all feedback is constructive, respectful and in the end, I hope it does in fact, force change.

There are so many of us that love it here, but there are also many that seem to be driven away due some of the circumstances you have ironed out.

Kudos to you chappie.

We should name a city Chuckle in your honour...

...Just for a laugh

Firstly, I would like to thank Chuckle for taking his time out to write this. It is a half hour read, but must of taking hours to write, read, and rewrite. What you can firstly tell is how much you care. How much you care about the game. How much you can about the future of the game. To often, people say 'if you want to change things, rank up' and whilst this is true in terms of changing the ingame status, what you are talking about is changing the way the actual games works, something that can not be changed by ranking up.

You hit the nailon the head on the majority of the things. And I agree with most of them. I will go into in more detail later...

The issue is as soon as you introduce money into a free game, it changes the boundaries. The main users no longer become the priorty. It is all about the protection of the payers. I read on IRC things like 'we can not change that as it is unfair on those who have spent money.' And this creates the issue....How will the issues within the game be solved? I do not know. But this will go a long way to making things better.

As a final point (before I go into main points at some point when I am not sleepy) one way to solve the problem (which I bought up in game suggestions) is to make accounts become weaker over time. Now this got some criticsm in the Suggestions Forum. However, the idea has been moved on. What should happen is your account is only as strong as the last 6 months. After that, It can not get any stronger. But you need to still put in the work to insure it stays that strong. So as an example; You kill once a day over the 6 months (for my poor maths, lets call it 500 kills). So you have a gun which is 500 kills strong. But then one day, you dont kill. Therefore, if you are after the 6 months, your gun reduces to 499 kills strong, And the only way to get the strength back is to be alive for the next 6 months, killing everyday, getting that 500 kill gun back. This will mean you are only ever 6 months from the top, and also it rewards people who continue to keep their character strong, but also adds in realism that you get weaker if you do not keep the work up.

This is a work in process and shouldnt go against what Chuckle is saying, more like alongside it, in terms of how to improve it.

What has to be remembered is what made this game great?

Simplicity

Secrets

The hope of being the best (whtether it be best killer, JBer, street talker, Pro'er, Ranker, etc)

Get these 3 right, and you have a fair fun game again!

Sounds neat, Grin. What's it about?

TL;DR

Nostalgia is a hell of a drug.

Having also gotten a sneak peak at this a few days earlier, I echo the thoughts of many when they say this is both an excellent and thought provoking read.

The one thing I think old Grinny really points out here is the need for more realism within the game.

Whether it be a more realistic approach to the BG system, random drug prices, DFPs or NPMs, it would be great to see some of the ideas that have been put forth here examined to see if they actually would be positive changes to the game.

Nostalgia is a hell of a drug.

Though i can agree with many sentiments regarding the situation in the game, as squishy has said some of the facts are wrong.  Nonetheless, the game isnt perfect for many and probably never will be.  i watch ideas come forward, get argued out and some of the time seems half and half on the direction players want to go.  No matters what said to me there will alwas be an imbalance when(if) people need a 4 figure whack rate or multiple cities bg shooting as have watched with sho and deadlysin and the target still lasting.  Fighting a city on a similar level even worse if you know/believe they have multiple targets and allies of that level and think can do some damage but know typically it will be a suicide mission.

I recently watched a game change how stats worked on a game which shares our irc server, it capped stats(i know a tapered system isnt the same) but it limited how strong over how long you could be.  The end product has been losing about a third of the members after people found themselves shooting and shooting and it being a case of grinding people down over days sometimes like the old wars of org(similar to december 02 angels war even better when many of us were clueless on answers).  The truth is any change has to be done carefully and with not too many changes at once to a point where people just say why play when the goal posts have changed 5 or 6 times in the last few months.

I couldn't agree more, Chuckle.

This game has become extremely boring compared to how it used to be several years back.

And despite your 'incorrect numbers, poor logic, and stretched truths' (really, Squishy...?), I think your fundamental arguments can't be overlooked by the admins. Changes are definitely needed. No matter how!

<blockquote>*Many veteran players, however, have become either jaded, misinformed to the point where they are self defeating, lazy, and even sometimes self entitled.

I will continue to make changes that I see fit to improve the game experience for the broadest amount of players, and I do this seeing all the actual data, the factual data. If I went on common misconceptions that the vets have, I think it would put the game in a very dangerous spiral that is not good for the longevity of the game, or it average player.*</blockquote>

I hope you do realize why those vets are vets, Squishy.
Only because they love(d) this game.

You make changes to this game based on only actual data - players only experience this game without knowledge of data.
However, when those vets see that this game turns into a boring, unreal and therefore no longer interesting game to spend time on, you may consider if your changes, based on those data, really benefit this game.

Maybe it's a good idea to mix both views and make changes accordingly - would be a huge waste to see those vets leave, right?

Don't get me wrong on this, please. I do appreciate your very hard working and I am sure that you can look at this as purely positive criticism.