Okay fine, you really want to have this debate - fine.

Do you know how tone deaf and narcissistic this sounds? In response to a topic about punishing poor performance, you lot have turned it into a suggestion about rewarding yourselves for your invaluable service to the community. Have I got that right?

Let me ask; how many of you coming out to defend yourselves now spoke out about Spike’s moronic inactivity thread, much less suggested additional rewards for CLs going above and beyond? Yeah, exactly - it’s fine for you to criticise other regimes, but once in power your mob want deified for systematically purging anyone with an iota of ability in the most painful, costly way possible, right Judgement (DangerClose)?

You derps have chased away large swathes of the player base, tanked the average hours, and now you want to reward the few uppers who actually manage hit that reduced minimum level of activity? And you’re doing it on a suggestion about punishing poor performance? The brass neck and lack of awareness of some of you is genuinely mind boggling.

“But we WhatsApp and Discord…” shut the fuck up. Just… okay?

I'm sorry you seem hurt. It's okay. I think you can be happy. Don't be sad SuperSaiyan. You can be productive. If you don't like us, kill us. Do it. Otherwise, all you're doing is whining like a sad puppy who isn't being given a bone, and that's ruff. 

We would not be effective if we were not active, in some facet. That said, it'd be nice to have all uppers commit to at least 10 hours a week (let alone 1 hour). However, no other regime has had that requirement really... And most HQ losses are accidents... But we're dealing with it. That said, communication is streamlined, so whatsapp and discord are completely relevant. The game has morphed away from using IRC/Lounge a lot (unfortunately), but on the 3rd party channels, things are active. 

I should note, the game population HAS NOT gone down from this time last year... So because your friends decided to walk away from a fight, it just means they're weak. They have no persistence. This is a game of persistence. If you don't play just because you or your friends aren't fairing well, then that just means you don't deserve to win. Tell me one time I backed down and stepped away in my history when I was not in power and bloodlined (for years)?... 

Wahhh waaah. I want a participation prizeeeeee daddy. That is all I hear. 

SuperSaiyan thank you for taking the time to come out here to cry like a little bitch cause you and your friends are ineffective and you're just saying that your friends gave up wah wah wah we can't do anything. It's not our fault that you and your friends are just wish.com us ;) 

 

If SuperSaiyan is who I think they are, then YES you and your little group use plenty of discord, WA, etc. It really just sounds like a bunch of bitterness because you all are not in power right now. And again, if you are who I think you are, there were plenty of IAs in your little troupe as well. 

I don't complain regardless, because I'm not trying to be CL. I've achieved GF and I don't plan on making any serious run any time soon. I just get tired of people crying and complaining when they're the ones that aren't in charge. EVERYONE has this so-called "solution", but then when it's their turn at bat, they do the EXACT SAME THING. 

Play the game for what it is. A GAME. Otherwise, find something else to do and touch grass. Simple.

You claim to know me (you don’t), and the best you dickheads can muster is misrepresentation and inaccurate ad hominem attacks. Well, since that’s your weapon of choice: -

Spike, you’re poisonous, and that’s all you are. You poison the well at every opportunity, thinking it’s some sort of genius, unique strategic manoeuvre. In reality, you’re a desperate, pasty, jobless basement dweller. You think 60+ hours a week online is a badge of honour. Without being a pretend mobster, you have nothing; no friends, no importance and no life outside momma’s basement. You’re to be pitied, not hated.

Remy, you love throwing around accusations which never quite hit the mark. You leave little or no impact from any run you’ve ever had cos, quite frankly, you ride on the coat tails of others; you’re a dried out, crusty limpet, barely hanging on for the ride. You’ve no real, discernible skill. I don’t even have anything more, cos you’re just a bit of a nothing. A fluffer for the rest of this stagnant, putrid regime. You can’t even be insulting effectively… “you wish.com us”? Tragic, bro. And I’m not even mocking the typo - that banter is just terrible; like something a boomer housewife comes out with, thinking it’s a slam.

Mila, yeah I don’t know you from Adam, and I don’t care either. You’re out here throwing around “I’ve been a GF” like it adds heft to your argument. The only time that happens is when the “GF” is a bit of a nobody, so it makes sense for you to be out here peacocking around with Remy. Apparently, however, you know me from this throw-away character, and my friends too, so clearly I’m living in your head rent free - and have been for a long time. You say touch grass, I think you’re projecting, son. Let go of the grudge. Whatever I did to you, I honestly don’t remember… and likely don’t care either.

Now that we’re done with these completely irrelevant, ‘should already be deleted cos they have no bearing on the topic’ replies, how about we get back to the suggestion at hand - and not get butthurt when folk list the reasons why they think this suggestion is a +1, contrary to the beliefs of morons saying they think ineptitude should be rewarded, not punished? Or is it more fun to continue derailing the suggestion making catty swipes centered around baseless assumptions?

SuperSaiyan, calm down son.

I don't know who you are; I don't really care. I just know you're disgruntled and pissy, the most tempting type of person to engage. I didn't say anything about you out of game, and I won't... No one else did. it's pretty lowly of you to try to do that. But here on this game, I'm going to assume you're a nothing and a crybaby.

Regarding your ad hominem at me, I'm sorry, @SuperSayian, but you're completely off... I am white, but shortly, I'm kinda the complete opposite of some sort of 8 Mile situation... I guess you know nothing about me outside of here then, other than my skin color. Cheers. That said, while I don't have a mixtape, I do murder mad rhymes. Chika Chika Sspppikeyyy.

As for my activity, I am supporting this game and my friends here. I rarely do 60 hours a week... but are you saying crewleaders shouldn't be active? Is that a diss in this? What? In this thread? Really? 

You're the one posting here, but not being productive. Instead, you come in trying to put people down and complaining about being a loser on the game instead of explaining your position in an adult-like manner. Cheers child. 

You clearly wanna fight just because people disagree with you. I don't know who MilaHoney is... Remy's post was trolling a bunch of people. I'm sorry it went over your head. But you got SO TRIGGERED by our replies to you. 

I do love how angry you are though, but you should learn to keep your Composure. 

If you don't like us, come kill us. Please. Do it. Make things interesting. Be better. Be a winner, like me!

Until then, I will light a nightly candle for you, and as the hot wax drips, so will my tears for your sadness, jealousy, and woe over our success.

:P

So you know nothing about me, but you assume I have friends - and that those friends have abandoned the game? Like I said - you’ve got nothing but baseless assumptions, and inaccurate ad hominems.

At no point have you even come close to engaging with the points raised about rewarding ineptitude. Instead you’ve resorted solely to trying to insult me because you can’t defend your position in that regard. You’re pathetic dude. My initial point was that certain respondents are selfish hypocrites who want your lot to be rewarded for tanking activity levels (not population levels, as you disingenuously tried to imply previously), and in response, you framed me as a crybaby - no attempt made to refute the central point. Textbook ad hominem tactics.

As far as saying I’ve resorted to out-of-game insults, then going on to say those insults are inaccurate… fuck sake dipshit, pick a lane. Either cry that I’m targeting you personally or recognise that I’m employing standard nerd pejoratives.

Finally, you don’t have the intelligence to make me angry; I just respond to the points put to me and highlight a couple of home truths. You may not like them, and you may prefer to hide behind a facade of trolling to escape the reality, but your own team have agreed that activity is down in this very thread. Your own side has said you lot should be rewarded for meeting that reduced activity level. I disagree. I say you’re purging anything over 40 days, in order to ‘Judgement’ the competition away. I contend that your policies of suppression is repugnant, it’s myopic and it’s destructive. That’s always been my point, and it’s the point you’re incapable of disputing, which is why you hide behind this turgid grandstanding.

Mea Culpa. I'm sorry if you're saying you don't have friends here. You seemed like a sociable fellow, and my assumption was improper. Why aren't we friends? Perhaps I also mistook your anger for... Frustration?

I haven't been too interested in this thread. You said my name. I wasn't in this thread. I don't care about it particularly, but for your entertainment and as an offering towards our new friendship... 

I think that the rewards for leadership are kinda trash to be honest, but heavy is the head that wears the crown. That is the cost of being a public figure. I don't think rewarding people for being extra active is good either. There are already some measures in place to the detriment of IA people in uppers... I think anything further would be overkill. I will stay firmly, I do believe that leaders and uppers should be active. If they're not, it's shitty, but people pick up the slack usually. And if their members don't like it, they can totally do something about it. I do wish someone would maintain my old thread. It was a good thread. Unfortunately, it is hard to find people who want the job in uppers, and there are a lot of risks in giving it to people you don't trust or know. But we have given positions to many newer players.

Everything is a balance. It's easy to build a gun here now. It's easy to die. Arguably too easy for both. I felt that when money was scarcer on the game, and at the same time, kills were harder to come by, while it was a slower paced game in some ways, it was overall a better environment because the (justified?) paranoia wasn't as strong. We play in the environment we are given. We adapt. 

My new friend, if you were on top and were trying to maintain power, tell me what would you do differently? What have other effective regimes done? And no, we're not killing everyone at 40 days, that's an exaggeration. It's definitely not indiscriminate like some other regimes of the past... But you do need to kill your enemies, right? This is a strategy game after all? 

I look forward to hanging out. 

SuperSaiyan, I seriously didn't want to take the time to read your whole post(s). You don't know me, I guarantee it. And even if you aren't who I think you are, you are still throwing a tantrum on a TEXT BASED GAME. It's okay though, I understand if this is your world, and you're mad you can't control it. 

Lol and you're taking it too deep. You're not living in my head rent free, I could care less about who you OR your friends are. I'm just assuming based on the bitterness and crying, that you and your friends are butt hurt about not running things. Back to my point (which you never truly addressed by the way), I can GUARANTEE it would be the EXACT SAME WAY if you all ran it. It'll be cool for a minute, then uppers start to become "inactive" and "boring". The EXACT things you are complaining about will manifest in another regime.

You say touch grass, I think you’re projecting, son. Let go of the grudge. Whatever I did to you, I honestly don’t remember… and likely don’t care either.

Again, I don't take this game serious and get hissy fits about who runs the game. I was not projecting AT ALL (I don't live my life here lol), it was more of a suggestion for you.

I am going to derail the flame war going on in here and maybe just pitch this.

Maybe my last suggestion was too harsh. Obviously and clearly I dont believe adding another reward will fix the issue and many of you agree that adding more game mechanics into the mix wont fix it.

So why dont we enhance or modify what we already have the "1 hour per week or crew disbans" standard

How does everyone feel about the idea of instead of 1 hour per week moving it to say 20/25/30 hours per month?

Obviously we need more then 1 hour per week worth of effort out of our upper structures to make things work around here, but I also recognize that setting a fixed per week time of say 5/7/10 hours per week sets an unrealistic demand that cant always be met and might otherwise catch an active crew upper out (See CL who has 60 hours week 1 but only 5 week 2 due to work, they are still an active CL just caught out by 1 bad week) 

Thoughts? 

So many replies, so little time.

Spike:

Firstly, who says I have any friends anywhere? My disdain isn’t confined to a virtual world, nor just to you. You’re merely a symptom of a larger issue. My distaste for society is absolute. You’re just representative of basically the worst it has to offer, as far as I’m concerned.

Secondly, I may have mentioned you in passing, but unlike you did me, I didn’t link you to the thread, so saying you haven’t been paying attention to this topic is nonsense. You were paying enough attention to notice your shitty thread was admonished within hours of it happening, so let’s not tell each other lies.

In response to you (finally) discussing the point in spite of your clear infatuation of me; finally we agree - albeit to some small degree. Whilst I definitely don’t think extra rewards should be provided, I too think further punishments would be perhaps excessively punitive. However, where we disagree is your inactivity thread. It’s sensationalist junk; accept it, let it die a death and move on.

As far as me postulating about tactics to maintain power… I’m more of a co-operative person. I’ll work with someone until they prove themselves to be a dick. Which you have. Numerous times. Perhaps that’s why you sit out in the cold for years at a time - cos you’ve proven yourself incapable of working with people outside your little legion of followers. You do underhanded shit because you’re never satisfied until you’re able to wreak your revenge for the consequences of your own actions. And around we go, ad infinitum.

Finally, yeah, you are killing anything you can’t confirm as white-listed at 40 days. Unless it’s the active street players. They get a week or there abouts, despite the negative gun consequences. I mean, let’s be honest here - Ketamine only has a position because you cleansed Chicago for having a competent, thriving population. You complain about not having vast options as uppers, yet you wiped active crews, and can’t see the absurdity of holding those diametrically opposing positions.

Anyway, this no longer worth my time or effort, so I’m just not gonna bother replying to you anymore - at least not here. If you want to continue this, tete a tete, my inbox is open because, let’s be honest, the suggestion forum isn’t the place for this sort of foreplay. K boo?x

Mila:

Mila… Honey, I specifically said I don’t know you. Saying that back to me isn’t the win you seem to think it is. Nor is saying you know me, then saying you don’t know who I am. You’re getting yourself all tied up in knots here babe. Just take a breath and think the next reply through properly.

And since you want a specific response to your allegation - I never said any regime would be any better. What I said was that demanding extra benefits for being better than the average, when you’ve gone out of your way to decimate the average is wank behaviour. Which it is.

Charlie:

Chuck, I’m all for spitballing ideas. Like you say though - I don’t think this is something game mechanics, rewards or punishments will fix, unfortunately. It’s a competition thing. When you remove the element of competition and any hint of vulnerability, the thirst to be first goes out the window. Just like when you surround yourself with yes-men, you no longer fear debate.

That’s why I don’t think we’ll see an increase in activity across the board until independent entities are allowed to develop. And then, of course, the cycle begins anew. It’s a tale as old as time.

The moral of the story is SuperSaiyan is a loser who would rather sit around and complain on a text based game because they don't like "the regime" that holds power in once again A TEXT BASED GAME that they're not even actively playing at the moment evidently. But you keep trying to sound intelligent and like your opinion has any baring on anything. Must really suck to have nothing better to do........

I'm going to chime in, despite how volatile this has become.

I maintain a fair level of activity, and the potential for myself or my closest cohorts to lose our HQ seems to be enough for us to maintain a relatively acceptable level of activity. I need not additional rewards, but in that same breath I don't see the need for additional penalties beyond what they are currently.

Now, all that being said:

Dragonball Guy:

I busted out my thesaurus and I still can't make heads or tails of why you came here to give your opinion outside of your disdain for Shoresy and SpikeS. You talk confidently, but you had to type 138 words (I counted!) before actually getting to your point- which is that you think nothing should change. Is this all just theatrics?

Whilst I definitely don’t think extra rewards should be provided, I too think further punishments would be perhaps excessively punitive.

Disclaimer: I don't know who you are, I don't know if you have friends or not, I don't have an infatuation with you. If I missed anything please let me know.

And since you want a specific response to your allegation - I never said any regime would be any better. What I said was that demanding extra benefits for being better than the average, when you’ve gone out of your way to decimate the average is wank behaviour. Which it is.

No one "demanded" extra benefits. The original issue was being punished more than what was already in place due to people having real lives and real jobs outside of this game. The other point was there are supposedly a bunch of players who want to be CL, but they can't and decided to blame the current regime for that. MY POINT was that being an upper isn't what it's all cracked up to be. MY OTHER POINT was that most people complaining about the regime will likely do the same thing if they were in power. They're just sad hypocrites because they aren't in power now.

Not a single person came here "demanding" extra benefits. It was suggested. Most people disagreed with the penalty part of it, because there are already enough penalties.

So again, your argument just sounds bitter and biased. You're acting as if one of the uppers made a suggestion "DEMANDING" they get extra rewards when that wasn't the case. Then you turned to personal attacks which showed everyone that you are just mad about whatever.

Lol like I said, this is a TEXT BASED GAME. If it's triggering you that much, perhaps re-evaluate what's important. Or not, and continue to waste energy arguing about a TEXT BASED GAME.

Remy - you wish.com us. That’s all the response you deserve… and still probably more than you can understand.

Transistor - so your mega burn is that you have a limited vocabulary? Cool story bro. But no, I said my piece then got regime fanbois breaking out the irrelevant insults, to which I responded in kind. I’ll explain it again though, just for you; wanting rewarded for tanking activity is wank behaviour. The theatrics were a response to the aforementioned insults. No insults, no theatrics. Nevertheless, if you look back, you’ll see I was incredibly concise initially. That attracted insults too, so I was damned either way really cos you dudes don’t accept criticism well, regardless of the method of delivery.

Mila, YOUR POINT initially was that YoU kNoW wHo I aM. Unfortunately though your hysterical semantics bore me. You should really find something better to do than argue about semantics in a TEXT BASED GAME. You got the gist, so don’t be so hysterical… go outside and touch the grass.

Anyway, it’s been fun. Til the next time I get bored, peace out ✌🏽

No my point was that everyone always cries about regimes being lazy (like you) except when it's them and their friends. Don't try to twist the narrative to fit your pity party.

Lol and the fact you said "YoU kNoW wHo I aM" shows your character beyond the game. Grow up and get a life outside of the game. It's not that serious kid.

So, seeing some of Shoresy's well thought out retorts and, as this thread, written in good faith by someone with a really fucking difficult to pronounce name about a game related issue, turned into an opportunity to flame and go, in general, woefully off topic, here we go.

Fucking lol at you, you fucking grade A little twerp SpikeS.  Here are some home truths for you.

• The vast majority of people you think like you, talk shit about you behind your back.
• You are a two faced, shit stirring, untalented little cretin.
• Without JTG, you are nothing.

I have first hand experience of the person you still seem to lust over saying, to me, the following things about you, there is more, but this should give you the general feel:

• He is a disgusting little fuckwit.
• He is such a slimey little fucknut.
• He is one of the, if not the, biggest cockwombles I have ever met.
• Ugh, he disgusts me, why do I have to deal with him? 

But hey, you are welcome to it, along with it's narcissism, sociopathic tendencies and STD's.  You can probably locate it in a bible study group somewhere in the Rawtenstall area, I can even give you it's address if you want it, you fucking weirdo.....

So next time you decide to bloodline me for things you know nothing about (mainly due to being circa 8000 miles away) I would suggest you don't just assume that you are going to get away with it, especially when the person you have do it (Transistor) has a RHM who, much like me, is fucking disgusted by you.  I mean, I know you are a fucking idiot, but lol, you have set a new low standard there.

Fucking phone calls at all hours to people about the game, fucking get a life, I know you have nothing in your life other than the game but other people have lives too you inconsiderate jerk.  Maybe use some of the time while other people get on with real life to learn how to make some real life friends, I know it is difficult for slimeball creeps like you but hey-ho.

I will light a nightly candle for you too, and as the hot wax drips, no wait........that would mean displaying some sort of emotion for the worst of humanity....ergo, you.

Fuck off.

Fucking phone calls at all hours to people about the game

This is all a lot to take in, and might I add these are some pretty flimsy Spike insults. But this line for some reason really tickled me. Can you imagine??? 
 

I was IA when the inactivity punishments and people losing their HQs started. I don’t know what prompted the change but if I’m correct there were placeholder-type Hands that were inactive and in theory deprive others of the opportunity to hold a position? Please correct me if I’m wrong. 
 

The code was obviously implemented as a measure to benefit the game. I am not under the belief that things are deliberately coded to be a detriment. But for people to lose a crew that requires a great deal of effort and money over instances that often seem to be accidental seems harsh and does not help player morale. 
 

I don’t have any skin in the game, no desire to lead or hold a position. Changes non-code related soured me on that. Now on top of that, Inactivity penalties. Is there be room for a happy medium, or was this the happy medium? Again I wasn’t around, but from where I stand way down at the bottom, it all seems to be a great cause for frustration for all sides involved. I believe 3 players lost their HQ in a week’s time. Just feels like the punishment far outweighs the crime IMO
 

I’ll let everyone get back to it. I would like to know who the female is that made those Spike remarks though. They were all profane and stupid, so I bet I have a pretty good idea!