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| What would you do | Started by: Alessia on Jun 14, '08 18:17 |
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Walking by the graveyard, Alessia sees an old woman wondering thru the piles of dead bodies. Bodies that have been piling up so fast, the cemetery could not keep up with the burials. Stopping, she watches her go from body to body, staring at some and patting the cheeks of others with fat tears rolling down her own. Listening to her mutterings, Alessia could only catch a word or two and what little she could hear included "innocent", "Shuki", "Belle" and other names that Alessia recognized from her ancestor's diaries. Occasionally a name would be muttered in a angry voice but then the old woman would say something about even tho it's you, it's not right. When the old woman reached Alessia, Alessia asked her to sit on the nearby bench and talk to her. The old woman was hesitant, appeared very frightened and asked if she was about to be killed. Of course not dear, why would I kill you? I just wanted to ask what you were doing Alessia answered, putting her gun out of reach in an attempt to make the poor thing feel safer Well young woman, I expect to be killed just as all these have been replies the old woman gesturing at the cemetery For tho I am not CP my mother was present during their reign and had no choice of other families to be with. So because of family loyalty and respect, she died in the war that wiped out that particular group of people along with most of their families. Then the gun manufacturers and bankers discovered they had done some wrong business dealings with everyone, so the dead's heirs are going to be benefiting from it, of which I am one. I don't wish to discuss with anyone nor have I as noone has even asked me who my mother was but I know I'm going to die like the rest of them.And you know, what I find so strange about it? Is that the mafioso clan calling themselves CP were wiped out because of the ways that were forced on the people, yet these same people are following in their footsteps. Anyway, it was nice talking with you child, you seem like a nice young woman, I believe I knew your mother And with that last word, the old woman disappeared into the cemetery, continuing her praying and speaking to the dead. Alessia put her gun back in it's holster as she gazed at the mounds of bodies, then turning noticed several mafioso had stopped to hear the old lady speak. Wiping tears from her own eyes, Alessia stood up to speak to them So, tell me, what do you all think of what this woman has said today? What other choices do the CL's have in finding the people who they wish to find without this happening? |
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Valiant looks at Alessia and smiles slightly. There is one way to find them, wait until they kill your leader and then when we find the witness statement, we can deal with them. But that doesn't sound good does it? I mean clearly you wouldn't want our Boss, Mr. Animal dead because we had to be "nice" in trying to find the so called CP's. Or what about the people that you care about, how would you feel if they all died because YOU wanted to be nice and let people do whatever with the powers they have been given by the Gods? Killing a few to save what...300 people or more? I think that's a loss we can take. I could be wrong, if I am, please do correct me, Miss Alessia. |
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| Reply by: Valiant_Luciano at Jun 14, '08 18:26 | |
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| Alessia dear, I have read my families diaries and have seen your name. I to have had my life threatened and it is soon to end. Before I go, I ask of you to tell the truth. Tell the streets that animal killed my grandfather after he swore to protect your family. Animal had no right, and should be punished, you are aware of that. Now I ask you and any other braves sole to defend the honor of my grandfather. Punish animal, put that S.O.B in the pound where he belongs. | |
| Reply by: Sinstarrthefinal at Jun 14, '08 22:55 | |
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| Alessia, I must say.... your stories match those of my own ancestors.... unfairly murdered in order for this "new world" to exist. My grandmother, mother, and even great-grandmother were murdered so that new dictators could replace old dictators. I feel that there is a very dark cloud shadowing these streets, and I don't see the clearing or bright sun that the CL's say will come (at the expense of the innocent). | |
| Reply by: Mia at Jun 14, '08 23:54 | |
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Animal is the head of my family, even if my opinion of something he did was different then his I would no more take it to the streets then I would attempt to shoot him. He is the head of my family and is owed all respect, loyalty and honor I have in my capabilites to act upon. Also, this is not what this post is about, please keep to the subject which basically is if you were a CL in these times, what would you do? |
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| Reply by: Alessia at Jun 14, '08 23:57 | |
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| ok Alessia I will leave your post, although my Grandfather and Father where both members of your family, or have you forgot that so soon? | |
| Reply by: Sinstarrthefinal at Jun 14, '08 23:59 | |
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I would agree with Valiant_Luciano on reasoning. This isn't a democracy. This isn't about human rights. This isn't about 'fair'. While it may or may not be fair, the killings are a means to an end. Some call it paranoia, some call it reasoning. I side with the latter. The bottom line is efficiency, and getting your objective done. While you might pull out the reasoning that this is no better than the previous system we all lived in, the takeover came just a little over a week ago-- whereas CP had 4 long months to show us what they were made of. You can't compare one of the same when you compare over 100 days to just little over 7. The conditions will improve over time, but meanwhile - we still have threats on the loose, and they intend on neutralizing them so we can all sleep soundly at night without waking up in the middle of the night wondering if your boss has just been slain over a comeback attempt. |
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| Reply by: Vic_Mackey at Jun 15, '08 00:07 | |
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Your point has some validity to it Vic. Some. But i'm not going to turn this into an argument about what has occurred recently, there are plenty of other street corners where that is already occurring. Rather, I will point out the fact that arguably the two cls currently holding the greatest power (Animal and Prem), whilst having great guns, unfortunately, do not have the brains to back those guns up. CP had great guns and they were reasonably intelligent. I fear for our future when our leaders struggle to even put simple sentences together. |
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| Reply by: Carlitos at Jun 15, '08 00:27 | |
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And how is this a fact? Rather, let's pose the same question to you: If you were a consigliere or a capo who had just had the run of his life taking out the organization that caused grief for dozens upon dozens of people, what would YOU do when you come to find out that they have most of their former power minus age? What would you do to keep power? What would you do to prevent round 2? Sit around, randomly promoting people upon their word alone until one of them ends up putting a bullet through your head the second you head for sleep? |
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| Reply by: Vic_Mackey at Jun 15, '08 00:42 | |
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I quite clearly said I would not be having that argument. As for how it's a fact...surely you are not blind, or deaf? Through choice, perhaps? |
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| Reply by: Carlitos at Jun 15, '08 00:46 | |
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And I never invited you to engage in an argument. :) I merely asked what your opinion was on the matter since, this is a question posed to the community by Alessia. If you make blatant accusations of crewleaders lacking intelligence, however, you're damn well sure to have some people banging on your door, though. |
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| Reply by: Vic_Mackey at Jun 15, '08 00:51 | |
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intelligence? yeah ok there is obvious electrical connections in some of them(CP) but...... Coming to the streets and berating someone for speaking their mind and spewing out a frigging thread or a response to one that has been written,read and opinionated on by every CP Leader,then run through a spell check and a thesaurus to make sure there is enough BIG words in there that make the common fucking plebes feel even more unworthy than they already are forced to be and yeah.....the CP made themselves out to be fucking geniuses didn't they? Give me a fucking break! Your forgetting that some of us were right in the fucking mix before they were taken out. |
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| Reply by: WhiskerBiscuit at Jun 15, '08 01:09 | |
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Oh, i'm well aware. I've done more than question a leader's intelligence, however, I had the good grace to conduct that discussion privately. As for my opinion, if I must... In the same position I would neutralise potential threats, of course. Who wouldn't. The manner of that neutralisation would differ, however. My gun would not have been out of it's holster quite so often. If I did have to use it, it would only be as much as absolutely necessary, when I had absolute certainty that I had the right target. The actions of the new regime over the past few days have been driven by utter, thoughtless, paranoia. The descendants of the previous regime would not have inherited their full legacy for some time yet. Greater consideration could've been given to the matter, instead, we shot first, and asked later. Diplomacy is an important skill that several members of the new regime quite clearly lack. |
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| Reply by: Carlitos at Jun 15, '08 01:13 | |
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And coming from a group so tightly knit, how would you know if you had the right target? As Jonnie, Animal, Apathy, Pantuseus and others have recently demonstrated -- a 3, 4, 5, or 7 man group very tightly knit can slip right under the radar, and they succeeded. So, from a group that can completely sustain themselves with money, and invisible bodyguards, and guns that can hit virtually anyone with said rank, it'd be quite hard to determine who's the "correct" target. There will always be casualties of war. As for your diplomatic comment, I believe that is true. However, they aren't the Government. They don't need to explain things, yet they do. I believe CP started switching to this attitude at the latter part of their reigns. This is the Mafia. They aren't obligated to explain, justify, or apologize for the actions they commit, fair or otherwise. I'm not saying that everyone should continue the trend of shooting people when doubt arises -- but given the circumstances, I'm behind it fully until they're sure their goals are met. |
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| Reply by: Vic_Mackey at Jun 15, '08 01:26 | |
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It's a tough one. On one side, you've got some highly lethal incog players who could rise to power much faster than normal due to their money, BGs, stats, and quite frankly, their belief that they were unjustly killed. (No, I'm not arguing that their fate was fair. I'd hate it if that happened to me, quite frankly.) On the other side, you've got a group of people who staged a coup and like it or not, that coup was successful. So, they took risks, won the right to run things, and now that they're in power, they're not exactly excited about being killed in their sleep. In the middle, you've got everybody else. I'd be willing to guess that CP and Mayhem aren't the only two groups that are plotting things. There always seem to be several undercover groups lurking around. But in this case, it makes it even harder for the current regime to keep control because if a few people slip through the cracks they could easily retaliate. Like I said, it's a tough one, but I believe that most people in the place of the current regime would be a bit paranoid and be willing to err on the side of caution (i.e. killing the wrong people to get to the right ones.) It's not like the mafia is a fairly run democracy in which everyone has equal say. I doubt any Don in the history of the mafia would just sit back and say "Damn, I rose to my position due to a freak accident so I need to let my enemies have a fair chance to come back and kill me. It's only the right thing to do." In the end, it's power that speaks. Those who have it like to keep it. And the ones that tend to complain the most in the streets are the ones who've lost it. In that way, this power struggle is no different than any of the others I've seen. |
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| Reply by: JarJarBinks at Jun 15, '08 02:43 | |
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Mia, I do believe the point of this discussion was to think of ways the current leaders can be successful at their task of hand, not to complain. Too many people have complained, yet they are speechless when it comes to constructive thought as to how they can do any better. Saying that there is a "very dark cloud shadowing these streets", yet offering nothing as to how to stop it from happening, doesn't help. In other words, you are just as much part of the dark cloud as the leaders that you accuse of being dictators. |
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| Reply by: Kira_Esposito at Jun 15, '08 06:10 | |
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"What would you do?" Isn't it just waiting for the inevitable to happen? Yes there are some so called 'bad apples' among us, probably planning and plotting a way to bring down the current leaders. That's a natural thing, there will always be underground groups. "But this group is different? They have more money, they are more lethal, bodyguards etc etc.. " In exception of the bodyguards - most rogue's aren't very well protected, it doesn't really matter does it? Underground groups will strike when they are ready, when they think it's feasible to succesfully bring down the reigning regime. If that moment is there, they 'will' strike full force. Them having certain skills will only speed up things... So what can you do to prevent it from happening? Nothing, just keep your ears and eyes open... As for the measures taken, they are counterproductive. In the end they will only lead to more loss, more sorrow and more discord. |
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| Reply by: Aleksandr at Jun 15, '08 07:39 | |
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"If that moment is there, they 'will' strike full force. Them having certain skills will only speed up things..." So Aleksandr, in the words of what someone said earlier, "There is one way to find them, wait until they kill your leader and then when we find the witness statement, we can deal with them." Is this what you mean when you say keep your eyes and ears open? Because that usually means waiting for a sign of sorts. What is the difference between, let's say, if someone told you they had no bodyguards, yet when it is discovered the person actually does have some (notice I did not say one), versus waiting until said person shoots and kills someone in a family? |
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| Reply by: Kira_Esposito at Jun 15, '08 07:52 | |
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There are a lot signs... "if someone told you they had no bodyguards, yet when it is discovered the person actually does have some" Here's a potential sign. If someone says he doesn't have any bodyguards and you have reason to believe he does have some, why don't you try to figure it out. You can't shoot a bodyguard that isn't there, right? |
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| Reply by: Aleksandr at Jun 15, '08 08:29 | |
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Um, I think I had that covered when I said, "...when it is discovered the person actually has some..." What I was trying to get at is, in both cases a leader could have reason to kill a new member (depending on what rules they have). Scenario A would be because they lied to their leader, and Scenario B would be because they killed someone in a family. My actual question was, which scenario would you prefer to happen - killing someone before they kill a valued member of your family, or afterwards? |
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| Reply by: Kira_Esposito at Jun 15, '08 08:55 | |
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