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| Whoring or a Savior | Started by: DaKine on Jul 15, '08 13:42 |
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Dakine takes a step in front of the crowd, he clears his throat and loosens his tie a little... Ladies and Gentlemen of our six cities, I have had this certain topic on my mind for sometime now, I really just had to address this and ask how everyone feels about it... Member whoring is when a leader or a right hand man is going out of there way to try and recruit members into there family is it not, now I know since my family line has been around this has been frowned upon. But with all the new criminals coming into this world of ours how are we going to assure that they are going to know that they need to have a family before a certain amount of time, I know the godfather of the city will send them letters as a civilian, and thug and I hope that they would read these so that they can pick on things like this. But that's not always the case; sometimes-innocent gangsters are left a stray without even knowing the danger their life is in. Personally I do not think its right to message every civilian that enters this world with a "hello, want to join my crew/family?" that would be member whoring at its finest. So my question is to you, what do you think we should do, what are your feelings on this? When does it become appropriate to contact these youngsters and let them know that without a family, they probably wont make it past gangster? Where is that line between member whoring and trying to help a new criminal into this world... Because sometimes last minute just isn't soon enough, they are getting eatin up by the vultures of this world way to quick. What do you think about this, if a family head or right hand man approaches the gangster who is running out of time in a fashionable matter, introducing themselves and there organization and giving them the heads up on the 48 hour rule of our six cities. And letting them know if they like they can have a spot in your family/crew/sub division, just because they have accepted the invitation to the family doesn't mean you have to stop interviewing them about what ever you like to learn more about this possible future member of our community, I would actually hope either way we are learning about our family members and meeting them all and doing this. Any way, maybe I have rambled on too much, let me know what you think I'm looking forward to everyone's response on this. DaKine posts up against a wall and lights a cigarette and waits to listen to other peoples views on this matter... |
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| I agree. This subject hasn't been touched on very much, if at all. Much of the game, I believe, is making a name for yourself doing whatever you can, taking the responsibilities that come with that. Such as, when you start off, you have the responsibility to find and join a family by whatever means necessary. However, if leaders advertise such as this, they must also deal with the problems that may come as well. | |
| Reply by: Zish at Jul 15, '08 13:46 | |
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Zish, I can assure you that this is no game. Every member of my family line has died from a bullet. Not once since my family has come over from Sicily has one of the Porcine familia died of old age. Anyhow, back to the topic of conversation... ...how are we going to assure that they are going to know that they need to have a family before a certain amount of time... Really? Are there not more safeguards than ever before in history to give this sort of notice? Not even counting, of course, plain common sense that says that if you wish to join the mafia, you join a family, and you do not work as a freelance artist. Which, of course, is antithetical to the concept of organized crime. If I see a Gangster running around who arrived to the city more than 24 but less than 48 hours ago, I might warn him that his life is in danger. I am not a complete brute in that sense. I also, however, believe in Darwinism. It was good enough for our ancestors, and it's good enough for me. After all, the cream cannot rise to the top if they are dragging the curds along with them. Sometimes you just have to let nature take its course when a certain segment of the population is too stupid or too lazy to make an effort to figure things out, especially with the lengths we go to warn them. |
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| Reply by: FlyingPig at Jul 15, '08 13:59 | |
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I think it's important that we all feel responsible for new blood mafioso as it's necesarry to keep this thing of ours alive. Of course a family head is a center of attention and of course a role-model. The path between help and member-whoring is thin. But there's a big difference between it. Member-Whoring would be a question to join a family just to get as many members as possible. But to help they don't have to be in a family, often it's enough to take them a bit under your wing and explain how things work around here. The different question is about those who are about to be gunfeed. Like you said it might be an idea to take them in and then continue interviewing. I think it's just the most important that everyone of us feel responsible, I remeber the like my father told me the stories of my ancestors and how they went around not knowing what to do till someone took care of them. And I can say I've learned my lessons. |
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| Reply by: SalvatoreLicata at Jul 15, '08 14:06 | |
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I believe that if one was a CL he should not have to whore himself around at all. New citizens of the game should simply find there own family. They (the new citizen) should shop around and do some research this would be good for there own right. Then all envoled would be a lot better off. |
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| Reply by: Medic at Jul 15, '08 14:38 | |
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** A passage from the diary of Father OMalley the First. My Great great great... grandfather ** ~Dec.12th 1932 What a strange new world this is! From the moment I stepped off the boat from my dear old Emerald Isle, Ive felt out of place and confused. I've felt the malevolent glances of passers by, that burn through me like bullets, making me feel as though I were a beef carcass, hanging off a hook in a butcher shop, that they might fire off their tommy guns into, just to test their aim. But on the other hand, Ive had kind words from total strangers, who seem to be able to tell just from the look of me that I am new to these lands, offering their assistance, and pointing me in the direction of the town hall, where I was able to take a few moments to read up on the laws of the land, and learn some very pertinent information that I truly believe will aid in my ultimate survival. One thing that was made abundantly clear, both from the passers by, and the books I read. Surely one must become part of a "family" to gain the protection and security they offer, should they wish to persevere in this world. **************************************************************************************************** As you can see, things have always been pretty much the same in our world. New people arrive daily from foreign lands. Some have an inquisitive nature and figure out survival techniques on their own the moment their feet touch solid ground. Others need to be led by the hand for a moment till they are confident enough to walk on their own. And others still will look around for a moment decide they don't have the patience, and hop on the first boat back to wherever they came from. So how do we get these people to stay, and make our population grow? How about a Community Outreach program? I'm sure every family has at least one member who loves to talk to and help people. These people could be in charge of not "whoring" these people to their own family's, necessarily, but just taking the time to point them in the right direction, and make sure they see the options that are available to them. And at the same time, through these conversations, these "mentors" can glean from them what sort of asset this recruit might be, and be a person of reference that family heads might turn to before sending out invites. I realize this isn't a completely original idea. I'm sure I recall reading of an "Adopt-a-gangster" program, in another land at another time. In my opinion, it comes down to this. "The Lord helps those who help themselves". But in order to help yourself, you have to first know what it is you're trying to accomplish. This is where we have to step in and gently push people in the right direction. |
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| Reply by: Father_OMalley at Jul 15, '08 15:10 | |
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My words mean very little to a number of those in the Streets, however I would like to offer my two cents on this if I may? ... Right then, well even if you don\'t want me to I think I shall. Long ago, there was a blob who came to these shores to conduct some social experiments, to find out what made things tick. Well since that day there have been a number of blobs who have passed on because they were either too dumb or too ignorant to find shelter. At least that is, I believe, the general consensus. Well I would like to put a slightly different spin on things, some of the first blobs, they were pointed in the directions of one Family or other. The first blob was even told to \"get a family\" as he was shot in the face, very useful advice, however, being scientists, the blobs decided to take a look at the world and see who it was that was running the show. From their notes, this was the major experiment that was running for a long while. What they saw, was that none of the Families really stood out as any different from any other. The Family heads rarely came to the Streets other than to announce \"WAR!\" or a new \"Auth\", and boy have there been a large number of wars, a lot of deaths, and a lot of changing leaders. Now looking out on the world, the blobs noticed a pattern, something that really disturbed them. There was nothing to draw them to a specific Family, nothing that said to them \"that\'s the Family for me\". And if joining a Family meant they were ordained for life, to give their life and soul for the Family, then they could not in all honest join a Family they were not sure they could really give their life and soul to. I would hope you can see their dilemma, they had two choices for their future. The first, to join a Family and risk the possibility of later finding out it was the wrong choice, that they could not continue to serve respectfully and thus would need to forfeit their life or go scarface on their whole Family. The second, to continue to remain unsponsored, to look out upon the Streets and try to find that thing that would make them want to join a Family and give themselves one hundred percent to that Family. As I am sure you guessed, being blobs of sound mind and science, they decided that they must make the second decision, and attempt to bring out the Family heads. To see if they could find what really made each Family tick, and find the right one for them. Now unfortunately, a number of Family heads have either decided that the blobs are not worth talking to, or they have missed the blobs speeches, and thus have not been able to respond. ... Right, I think that explains the position of the blobs past, present, and I would hope, future blobs also. So now, in direct answer to your question, I, blob7, ask that each Family head does not go out to actively try to recruit via mail, do it in the Streets. We all walk them, we must if we are to make it in this world, so come out and tell us what makes your Family special. Anybody with half a brain, and I\'m sure you aren\'t really looking for those who don\'t have at least half of a brain, can make a decision if they have something to go on. Give them that something, ask those in your Family who you think can speak best of your Family to come to the Streets and tell us all enough to make a decision. Don\'t send mails and \"whore\" make to the Streets and do it instead. ~blob7 |
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| Reply by: blob7 at Jul 15, '08 15:22 | |
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I vote for Whoring. Jesus had his chance already. *my thanks to VendettaJames for the inspiration, actually, I totally stole your comment but thanks anyway* |
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| Reply by: Oompa_Loompa at Jul 15, '08 15:26 | |
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This has a very simple answer in my opinion. If you are, as you say, concerned with the community then approach these individuals to explain how things work and help find them a Family. If you are not approaching them for yourself how could it be whoring? If it is your numbers you are worried about take this one step further. The very people you help have the greater odds of dying from mistakes. When they do return will they return to the Family that punished and taught them a lesson or will they approach you the one who helped them in their time of need? In the long run these people will come to you and be more loyal then if you chase after them because they will respect what you did for them. A win win situation! |
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| Reply by: UncleNicky at Jul 15, '08 15:40 | |
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| I say invite first ask questions later. If you decide at a later time that this person is uncapable of being a good crewmember then hand him over to the hit squad. | |
| Reply by: Justino at Jul 15, '08 17:05 | |
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I try to send every new immigrant to these lands a letter with advice on how to succeed. I also add in a disclaimer that it is not an attempt to recruit them into my family. Whether they join me or whether they join someone else is incidental. I simply want to do everything I can to help the young members of This Thing of Ours have every opportunity to succeed and become valuable members of our society. |
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| Reply by: Daera at Jul 15, '08 17:16 | |
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I personaly think whoring is a bad way to get members to join you. If I see some fresh off the boat running around I'll give him a bit of advice, you know, let him know the score then let him make up his own damn mind who to try and join or if he's still working my city after 48 hours have him dealt with. |
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| Reply by: Ace_Rimmer at Jul 15, '08 17:40 | |
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| I believe that you need to earn a spot. Taking someone in who you dont know can lead to bad consequences. Besides, those who want to be in a certain crew will make more money for that crew as opposed to just being invited randomly | |
| Reply by: Shagggyd at Jul 15, '08 18:01 | |
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Listening to DaKine as she usually does ArmyBrat would like to say a few words on this subject. In the big world of business do not the employers put out an ad in the papers to fill jobs. And if we are good upstanding citizens we answer the ads to get a job. Well here in lays the problem "WE are MOBSTERS". Do we answer an ad in the local gasette, hell no, we must search the cities streets and sewers to find the scum we like to hang with. In this being said should the bosses come to that level, the answer would be "NO". It should be a "Gangsters" job to recuit new folks from the realems of the many civilians out there that are looking for a little more excitment in life. At least that would be my answer, We recuit and send the names and information forward to the Boss then he alone with his trusted advisors can pick whom they want. |
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| Reply by: ArmyBrat at Jul 15, '08 18:04 | |
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| Personally I believe that we have more than enough protections for the new people off the boats. Now as to the so called "Member Whoring" I'm of the opinion that a Family head is not much of a Family head if he is out there trying to get the minions to join himself. That is what a Family head has other minions for, so they can do that kind of work for him. | |
| Reply by: ThePhoenix at Jul 15, '08 18:09 | |
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I believe that 'Whoring' for members of your family is a dispicable and not needed practice around these streets by 'whoring i mean a single - or a few meaningless - mails and an invitation sent, the mail can usually be something along these lines "hey you need to get a family im sending an invite now" of course there are other mails saying other things but you get the idea. now on the other hand. recruiting people for your family I think is a practice not used enough around here yes there can be a fine line between whoring and recruiting, but i would say why shouldnt a Leader approach a person new around here if he wants to take them in show them the ropes and put the time and effort into helping them and his own family succeed then isnt that a good thing? I think some people around here believe just because a leader approaches someone then they are whoring them, now as long as they let them know there are other options and other people the person could join if they so wanted, but at the same time, letting the person know they are wanted to join the CLs own family as they think they can help them make the most of there life then I would say this is the CL looking to expand his own family and gain, possibly, a valuable new recruit. some leaders love to help people and by getting in touch with new people first they have the chance to do that, and in my opinion that can never be a bad thing. some people may say we should make it so that you have to be approached by someone to invite them, not all new people understand our way of life when they arrive and if they fall foul of the first keen gun because they didnt get in touch with the right people quick enough then there ancestors may never step foot on our great streets. just my thoughts on this subject I have heard this raised a few times but I think it is a subject which can provoke different thoughts in people depending on the circumstances. |
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| Reply by: Giovanni_Moretti at Jul 15, '08 18:40 | |
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"Many, many, many, many, many, many, many, many, many, many, many a year ago, recruiting was acceptable. Family heads would be out there looking the street, searching for the finest talent out there and personally I see nothing wrong with it. If you see a promising citizen roaming the streets, you would rather have them in your Family doing yourself proud, than with another Family." Bunsen ruffles his hair and begins to speak again. "However, I disagree with recruiting every Tom, Dick and Harry. I think you should put a recruit through all the stages. See how they perform with the crimes you want them to commit, see how the person intergrates with society and how they react with the rest of the Family. If they past these tests then they are a sensible addition to the Family. If they fail, well you just chuck them back on the street. Since when has scouting for the best been such a dumb thing to do?" |
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| Reply by: DrBunsenHoneydew at Jul 15, '08 18:59 | |
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Recruiting the "best" doesn't require scouting. They should be right there in your face. As far as a Boss recruiting...No! Come on, think about it! The top dog, the head honcho, the big cheese - the most respected man (or woman) in la famiglia...standing out on the streets pandering to hoodlums? If your mind is still capable of rational thought, it should be easy to see how implausible this scenario is. Now then, should a Boss NEVER approach a possible recruit first? Not necessarily. However, when this is done, it should be under circumstances that are not as ridiculous as the aforementioned scenario. When would a Boss actually give his time to approach someone unaffiliated with a job offer? Well, probably never, but offering flexibility in the way we do things here, I would say it might be acceptable when that Thug has made a name for himself. Yes, this doesn't really happen much these days, but if the Thug were to be out on the streets impressing those who can see him with his activities, then sure, why wouldn't a Boss at least SEND someone to speak with the man about a job offering? But approaching any old dirty bum who hasn't even expressed his talents in any way? Naaaaaaaaaaaah. His induction into La Cosa Nostra needs to be a learning experience where he comes to understand that he must put forth effort to get the things he wants. Putting forth effort is something that is overlooked these days. One should have to put forth effort to get into a family, to train their skills, to get an important job within the family, and MOSTLY to receive auth. Is it too much to ask that we expect people to put forth effort for these things? |
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| Reply by: FlyingPig at Jul 15, '08 21:30 | |
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I and my representatives send out a help message whenever we see someone fresh off the boat, it does not ask them to or steer them towards joining us, we send them out even when we are full. It includes information on how to join a family but not mentioning ours in particular. We've had the usual "member whore" replies - which frequently make me laugh as my HQ is full and no invite has been mentioned or sent but usually in the case of a person fresh to our shores, it is received with gratitude and further questions. I don't believe this is member whoring in anyway as there are frequent changes to this world of ours that are not mentioned in our bibles. |
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| Reply by: Alessia at Jul 15, '08 23:48 | |
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| It's always going to be hard to get those new to the game to send messages to the current leaders. Unless they take the time to read the tutorial, there is no way for them to know of the incoming doom that comes with not joining a family. Should you message them and tell them about the danger they face? Maybe. Maybe not. I guess it's really up to those in charge to decide. I think it's the right thing to do though. | |
| Reply by: Corleone_Jr at Jul 16, '08 02:56 | |
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