You have probably noticed that the decision has been made by several cities within MafiaReturns to remove the ruling family from St Louis. This was not a decision that we took lightly.

This was not a sudden move and has been steadily building for the past several weeks. It began with Caius' continual disrespect aimed towards me and the fine city of New Orleans. Grassboy was informed of this and assured me and Godfather Kenobi that the problem would be dealt with. We thought no more about it.

However, the matter was not resolves and Caius was outright disrespectful to Godfather Kenobi even going so far as to threaten him with a thinly veiled message. This was clearly unacceptable behaviour and it was once again reported to Don Grassboy to deal with. What punishment was meted out? Caius was promoted to Right Hand Man. Indeed.

To conclude my awful relations with Don Grassboy's RHM I was forwarded a conversation by one of my trusted members where Caius clearly approached him and offered him a position within his crew, which although he was yet to have, he felt he would be getting soon. Not only was he trying to recruit my LHM, an outright insult to me, but he also disclosed he wanted 'known hitters', for what purpose Grin wonders?

Well in the face of this continued disrespect and Caius seemingly being rewarded for it, we have decided that enough is enough and matters have been taken into our own hands. We harbour no ill feeling towards Don Striphe and thus feel it would be unfair to have targeted him in this attack when our problems do not concern him.

Why Bobblegob? He was the RHM to Grassboy and thus poses a problem when his former leader and the man he made his bones with is being forcibly removed. On top of that the same problem has been witnessed with a lack of discipline when dealing with Godmother Aurora and swift punishment of a member. We thought it prudent to take no further chances.

~G~rin out.

I remember a time when giving people one chance was considered one chance too many. The development of a more tolerant approach has lead to calmer waters and bigger profits; but when a Boss and one of his top guys conduct themselves in manner such as our friends from St. Louis, there was only going to be one outcome.

Just to clarify a bit what Grin spoke about above;

About a week ago, I returned from a business trip to find a mail on my desk from one of Bobblegob's members. It read some pretty explicit and uncalled for words in my opinion. Instead of taking this man out myself, I went to Bobblegob since he was available at the time. Bobblegob assured me that the views this man had about myself and my city were purely his own and that the rest of his members, associates,and himself did not share those same views. He also assured me that his man would be sent to death swiftly. I thanked him and told him I looked forward to a swift removal

I waited, and waited, and waited even longer for this member of his to be removed as he he promised me so swiftly and yet nothing happened. It wasn't until over an hour later then this man was disposed of so 'swiftly' as promised. After that he told me that he had to wait for his right hand to fly instead of taking care of the issue as soon as he could. He felt that this issue didn't call for the urgency he promised.

I couldn't afford to have any other issues like this from members of St. Louis families.

My father didn't know what was going on when he got killed

From this point on, I would request that no further St Louis members below the rank of Made Man are shot. They should be given time to find refuge with Don Striphe.

Firstly, I'd like to say that this will be my only reply to this thread. As my blood line has learned, to the victor goes the history writing. That being said, lets line out some facts.

Firstly, we deal with my father's disrespect of Grin. It is true that my father Caius 'disrespected' Grin in the 'OOC', after Grin began disrespecting a brother of his in Saint Louis. I will not sit and argue with you, in my father's eyes it wasn't disrespect, I am sure in Grin's eyes it was. My blood lines loyalty has never been questioned and my father felt the need to voice his opinion supporting his brother.

What was done? A demotion of my father, and with holding of rank for quite some time. After seeking counsel of my blood lines long time mentor, my father decided to make amends taking the bigger man's approach. Apologizing profusely, and paying more then 10 million in crackdowns to Grin. With an agreement that my father felt mutual, that while they would never be the best of friends, they would indeed try and have a positive business relationship.

Secondly, your left hand was never approached on the streets, or mailed to come with my father. However, he did have a conversation in the coffee shops with said individual, offering him a spot in the upper echelon of the family he was told was his the moment Don Grassboy achieved the rank of Godfather. At that time, my father had no idea, who said left hand was. He merely knew his blood line from a working relationship our blood lines shared in Los Angeles under Godfather Premeir.

I am told that this was the 'turning' point for New Orleans. I find it odd that New Orleans would jump there guns so quickly without looking into the facts of the matter beforehand. I also find it ironic that you didn't include the payment that was made to Grin from my father, which was not mere 'pocket change' for an individual without a sizable crew.

My father was never rewarded with anything, however he was extremely active in this life, dedicating time and energy, as well as sending up an extremely large amount in tribute, totaling to more then 35 million at the time of his death. More then ten times what any other member in Don Grassboy's crew had earned, or sent up.

As for the situation with Bobblegob and the Godmother from Las Vegas. The situation was handled inside the city, Bobble was told that mistakes like this cannot happen, if he isn't able to pull the trigger he must take other actions in a timely fashion. My father and Don Grassboy were sufficiently satisfied with his response, and we believed the matter to be closed, knowing full well the issue would not arise again.

Firstly, we deal with my father's disrespect of Grin. It is true that my father Caius 'disrespected' Grin in the 'OOC', after Grin began disrespecting a brother of his in Saint Louis. I will not sit and argue with you, in my father's eyes it wasn't disrespect, I am sure in Grin's eyes it was. 

What your father did was to take this from OOC discussing historical issue, to slating the current NO leadership in-game. Unacceptable to me, regardless of venue.

What was done? A demotion of my father, and with holding of rank for quite some time.

I don't remember this, but I wouldn't know to be honest, but I do remember your father being a Made Man, making veiled threats to me in my mailbox. There was no demotion here, despite me discussing it with Grassboy directly. Granted, he told me your father was on a last warning. Then what? Promotion to RHM a week later and confirmation that he was soon to be authed. I'd consider this an aggressive auth in the planning after your father's earlier comments to me in private and Grassboy's awareness of them.

Secondly, your left hand was never approached on the streets, or mailed to come with my father. However, he did have a conversation in the coffee shops with said individual, offering him a spot in the upper echelon of the family he was told was his the moment Don Grassboy achieved the rank of Godfather. At that time, my father had no idea, who said left hand was. He merely knew his blood line from a working relationship our blood lines shared in Los Angeles under Godfather Premeir.

Whether you like it or not, the coffee shops are as much a part of the game - if you choose to use them - as the streets themselves. Your father may not have known who the left hand was, but even after he was told that this man was currently an LHM, your father insisted on re-iterating that there was a spot available and rewards would be there waiting. Regardless of what city he was an LH in, this is not on.

Regarding the rest, your father's loyalty, hard work, commitment and so on is not being questioned. Only his handling of a relationship that was already fragile. As you acknowledge, there is no need for great debate here, it serves nothing except to waste all of our time.

I suppose the moral of this lesson is to keep your thoughts to yourself - and watch who you talk to.



On any other scenario, though, I would have expected a situation like this be a one time deal - veiled threats, animosity, the like.. However, I think it's plausible to believe that leniency was only granted out of concern for the massive investment others made into your father's security fund.

Secondly, your left hand was never approached on the streets, or mailed to come with my father. However, he did have a conversation in the coffee shops with said individual, offering him a spot in the upper echelon of the family he was told was his the moment Don Grassboy achieved the rank of Godfather. At that time, my father had no idea, who said left hand was. He merely knew his blood line from a working relationship our blood lines shared in Los Angeles under Godfather Premeir.

I could have understood the offer if maybe I hadn't arrived on the shores yet and you sent a letter home to Sicily. Instead you waited. Lucretia_Borgia knows my bloodline better than almost anyone in this "thing of ours". Yet not once has she offered me a spot telling me of all the great things I could have.

In the words of the infamous CP, I HAVE ZE LOGS.

Good day.

However, he did have a conversation in the coffee shops with said individual, offering him a spot in the upper echelon of the family he was told was his the moment Don Grassboy achieved the rank of Godfather. At that time, my father had no idea, who said left hand was. He merely knew his blood line from a working relationship our blood lines shared in Los Angeles under Godfather Premeir.

I don't understand. You said this as if you think this is a defense, but to me it reads as an admission of guilt. I would never even begin to dream of doing the grave disrespect of trying to recruit a member from under a leader's nose, in mail, in the coffee shops, anywhere. That goes all the more for a left hand man. That you would approach someone who you admit you didn't even know in an attempt to recruit them just speaks volumes. Other leaders' members are not yours for recruiting. End of story. To act otherwise was extremely disrespectful, and I am not at all surprised to see dead bodies in the aftermath of such an attempt.

Bravo for cleaning house, Grin et al.

I rarely make comments these days due to my old age, but sitting by and watching what this so called "Mafioso" Caius used to say was amazing to say the least. I don't know how anyone could come up and have a defence for some of the actions he has done, from what looks like constant back tracking on stories and stories built on sand it boggles my mind that such a member survived so long.

To echo Don Borgia, it was about time the rubbish was taken to the dump.

Ah well I did try atleast lol

If anything was annoying people, you could of just let me know, I also informed most people that if there was anything wrong to come to me and I could sort the situation out.

Also Caius did rank minumim time but I held him back for a long time, Tesler who is with you now Grin can confirm that.

Although whats done is done, you obviously felt I wasn't doing a good enough job and thats fair dues.

Thanks to everyone for giving me a piece of the life anyway, was fun while it lasted. :)

Grassboy

Circumstances and events conspired against your father. I wish you and your future generations nothing but the best.

DidMyBest, from my reading of Grin's speech, it would appear that part of the problem was because your father didn't deal with the problem as he should have.

It seems that Caius' offences were punished with nothing more than a promotion withheld for a few days.  Indeed, he was given the RHM slot and seemingly promised the chance to branch out on his own, in the event of your father becoming Godfather.  Hardly punishment worthy of threatening a Godfather and disrespecting the Godfather's RHM (as Grin was at the time).  I'm sure the patience of the cities involved had run out before the attempted recruiting of a New Orleans LHM became the straw that broke the camel's back.

Indeed, I'd go as far as to say that the cities who felt threatened by these developments would have been negligent if they hadn't dealt with the situation.

Protection should have been granted for those whom this did not concern.  Mis-handled.

The fact that you address the matter with a "lol" and a shrug of the shoulders confirms the amount of maturity your father had for his position.

Perhaps it wasn't your fault, perhaps you were pushed into a position of responsibility before you could walk but it was your responsibility to accept or decline such a position. If the stories are true that your father was close to becoming the Godfather of the city god only knows how low the actual status of such a position would become.

I think there can a lesson learned from such circumstances. That running a family is a lot tougher than people believe, it takes a lot of effort, intelligence and charm to influence and inspire people around you. As one of the greats used to say how many Crew Leaders will actually be remembered? Its not how long you are bold for but what you do when you get there certainly can guarantee your father will not be one of those remembered.

Perhaps you or future siblings could take your time to such a position and learn the ropes before taking the leap into a bold suit, and then perhaps such circumstances would not cost your family so dear.

Maybe thats another question in itself.

If you were offered the position to run a family would you accept it even though you were not ready? Would be so bold to say No someone else should do it, or are we all to scared to admit we are not ready for such a position of responsibility

Protection should have been granted for those whom this did not concern. Mis-handled.

Ever heard the saying to the "Victor go the spoils". Well in true MR fashion, everyone that was not concerned was given protection by the attacking families. Just because it hasn't been posted in the streets doesn't mean it hasn't been granted.

And if your referring to what Grin said interms of people joining ForRent during his rogue/soldier HQ. If your in the heat of the battle and involved, expect a war like treatment.

I think that's fair treatment.

Protection should have been granted for those whom this did not concern.  Mis-handled.

You must have missed what I said at 07:53...

By that point, the death toll was many of those who had nothing to do with the inner workings of the family.

To be honest who ever signs up for work with GrassBoy and Bobblegob signs up for what they believe in, perhaps those members should actually think about whom they will join next time and not just jump into bed with the first person to open the door to them.

The families involved in the takedown of St Louis has shown great amount of leniency in sparing those alive, as i have been witness to tougher times when a takedowns not just took down the heads of the family but the whole family.