Gaius sat in his den, smoking the last of many cigarettes, the smoke curling upwards like a ribbon. His thoughts spiraled their way up with the tobacco fumes, gathering in a cloud near the ceiling. The ashtray was overflowing with more than three packs worth of butts, ash scattered across the end table like fingerprint powder. Gaius had been so deep in thought for the last several hours he hadn't even touched his drink, which had taken on the variegated look of scotch and melted ice. Earlier in the day he had a lengthy discussion with the Godfather of New York about loyalty and what it meant.

With the conversation fresh in his mind he sat and devoured each aspect of it, trying to learn from the wise older man. A man who held power with ease, and showed little wear and tear. Gaius nodded to himself, smiled and reached for a picture of his great grandfather. This was the man that his blood line was most proud of. The man who had fought and died protecting the Godfather he loved. This was the man Gaius was named after.

Gaius' bloodline had always been the loyal sort, pledging their lives to their Godfather, the world be damned. Gaius was no different. Upon entering this life, the Godfather of New York had brought Gaius into his arms and explained his father's death. He allowed Gaius to have his revenge on the individual in question. For that act alone, Gaius would remain loyal to him for life.

Regardless of his own loyalty, Gaius felt he had witnessed others turn their backs on the men who had raised them to the positions they now occupied. The recent matter in Detroit weighed the heaviest on his mind.

Gaius decided he needed to speak his Godfather, and sent a note with one of his bodyguards to Deimne's villa, requesting him that should he have time, Gaius had some more questions. He understood what a busy man Deimne was and that a mere goomba meeting with a Godfather was quite un-precedented. However, he didn't brag about his meetings and instead used the opportunity to learn from the man. After waiting for what seemed like hours, a time and place were arranged. Gaius promptly showed up half an hour early and waited for Deimne, watching leaves drift in lazy circles.

As the Godfather arrived, Gaius motioned for his bodyguards to form an inner circle and protect the two men as they walked. Deimne enjoyed the long walks and conversations with Gaius, often using his hands to punctuate points he had just made. The older man reached into his pocket and took out a cigar, offering a second one to Gaius, who declined as he held up a newly lit cigarette.

"I just... I just don't understand." Gaius said between drags.

"What is it you don't understand?"

Gaius tried to keep his voice steady, but his hands trembled slightly as his frustration began to turn to outrage.

"Not two weeks ago, Pedro backed us in a war. Then we watch him get slaughtered?" Gaius struggled to keep his temper in check, and it was apparent the Godfather noticed it.

Deimne waved his hand and then placed it on Gaius' shoulder before speaking.

"The war where we backed them?" Deimne smiled softly, but the pain of losing so many old friends in the war still brought him pain when he thought of it. "Pedro backed our colleagues in Philadelphia, not us my young friend. Just as we backed them, once I became aware of the situation. Do not forget that, for it is very important.

What you need to understand about this last war was that it was down to business decisions and how they were handled, not a question of friendships or fights. Pedro was enforcing a tax, that was originally Godmother Marietta's introduction, but at a time when there was a fraction of the bum's to offer for this payment. My suspicion is after being preyed on for quite sometime the bums grew weary and vacated his city. Additionally, he had differing relationships around the eight cities than Detroit had in the past to help with enforcement of the tax, so as others viewed his city as growing weaker with the departure of Kates and Rhuarc, the payment of such a tax seemed a less attractive proposition.

From what has been told of the situation, two different cities went to him with concerns about the tax. It is my belief that the reason for war was not alone the tax, but a combination of the price of the tax relative to the benefits gained, the view that Detroit didn't have the backing to enforce the tax and the percieved disrespect in how the negotiations raised over the tax were handled."

Gaius tried to wait patiently for his Godfather to finish but snapped at the end, waving his arms like a madman, his face red from the fury and the cold.

"Bullshit! Loyalty is loyalty. Where were the people to support him? He had helped others in wars, why didn't they step in and fight alongside Pedro? He had authed people into positions of power, they wouldn't even have a city to lead if it weren't for Pedro! So where were they when he needed them?"

Gaius finished and rubbed his temple, his face burning from his fit of temper and humiliation at his inability to keep it in check in front of the most powerful man in the city. He knew the amount of restraint his Godfather showed towards him when he had his little outbursts, and tried to calm down, reaching into his jacket for his flask, offering the Godfather a drink before taking a shot of the fiery liquid.

Deimne waited for a more natural hue to return to the young man's face before speaking.

Gaius reached in his pocket and pulled out a thick envelope his father had picked up from the late Godfather of Detroit. It was full of favors for his uncles and a tear fell down the young goomba's cheek. The Godfather brushed it aside and smiled.

"Did Pedro come to you?" Gaius asked as he looked into Deimne's eyes.

"About the war? No, I was out of country."

Gaius forced back the rest of the burning tears and looked up at the Godfather.

"I don't understand why Kates didn't join in the war? She came from Detroit, I don't understand. I know it can be seen that a city grows weaker as they auth new city heads... isn't that supposed to make you stronger? Like you've done authing new cities from New York?"

The Godfather smiled and grabbed Gaius by the shoulder.

"Gaius, my dear, dear boy. You really have no idea do you? Kates has a loyalty to her family and her city, and no one else. Her only concern is, as it should be, to those who reside in the city of New Orleans. This is no different to me and those who call New York home, nor any other city leader. Friendships and business agreements, while vital to cosa nostra operations, don't compare to the bonds and the responsibilities to our families."

The Godfather waited patiently as words began forming in Gaius' mind. They had many talks, and this one was no different. Gaius was very thorough and wanted to make sure he understood clearly. He understood that he was learning from a master here, for the man would not be where he was currently, without being extremely gifted in the political department.

Once his thoughts had formed he spoke.

"So you mean to tell me, that if I was granted auth to lead a family under you. I serve my time and you were to grant me a city of my own. Then some idiot attacks you, I'm not supposed to join in and fight alongside you? The man that gave me my start? The man I swore my loyalty to?"

The Godfather smiled and nodded.

"The moment you take control of a city, your loyalties no longer lie with me, or anyone else. They are 100% to the members of your city. The members who are willing to put their life on the line for you day in and day out, are the ones you need to make every decision to protect.

If I should come under attack for ignoring requests for justified reasons, you shouldn't join out of a sense of loyalty or obligation. There is no justification to that. If there isn't a benefit for your city in putting their lives at risk, you shouldn't dream of putting them into that position. Knowing where and when it's best to make such a call, to protect those you trust, to keep allies alive or to help remove threats to this thing of ours is the most difficult call a leader has to make. All of the factors will be weighed up before a decision is made, but there is no obligation or loyalty that requires it... a leaders loyalty is only to those that work for them. No exceptions."

Gaius's rage was boiling again and he almost screamed at his own Godfather. Instead his voice came out in an anger choked growl.

"I don't give a fuck what the reason is, someone attacks you, my duty lies there. You're the one that has protected me and my father from the beginning. Fuck what the world thinks." Gaius rubbed his temples and listened as the Godfather explained further so he would understand.

The Godfather sighed and took Gaius by the shoulders, looking deep into his eyes to make his next point clear.

"Kates has a city to protect, New Orleans. Her loyalty, her responsibility and her devotion is to them. It doesn't matter what situation arrises, her number one priority will be to her city. As my priority will always be to my city. If it benefits New York for me to enter into a war, I will, but I will never put a New York life at risk if it isn't in the best interest of the city. No sense of loyalty, no friendship, no percieved favours owed and no guilt will ever lead me into war. It sounds cold and it sounds harsh, but trying to sleep at night with the guilt of a lost soldier on your mind is a far tougher thing to deal with than anything else. When any leader gets their own city, the ties to any other die. Their loyalty to a previous leader is gone and their ties to a prvious city is gone, their loyalty must be to their city."

Gaius looked back at the man standing before him.

"You show an enormous amount of patience with me Godfather. I thank you for it. If I may-"

Gaius looked at the Godfather, and before he could speak, the Godfather rose his hand.

"What you must understand Gaius, is that we each have our way of doing things. For you, loyalty to the end no matter the price, the world be damned. For me, and others like me, we look at the situations and circumstances before pulling the trigger. Would I risk my empire for something I believe in? Of course. How we live and who we die for is what makes each leader different. There's nothing wrong with it."

Gaius nodded and thanked his Godfather, before inviting him to a cup of coffee. It was declined, business was waiting after all.

Loyalty can indeed be a ticklish subject.

I think on the outset, most people want to say that they would stand up and fight for their own family first and then for the people who have supported them. But when the matter changes because your own family and your supporters are separate, or because you changed cities, or because you can't back a decision they are making... That's when you look to your own borders and do what's right by the people you serve.

I think the example here is one of the toughest around, but I think Kates handled herself admirably.

Always a tough one though, no easy answers.

I think on this point Deimne is most definitely right, although I imagine it would be hard to turn your back on a previous family, you must protect your own interests.

I'll give you a scenario and I'm curious to know your answer, although you're not olbiged to answer of course.

You have proven your loyalty and Deimne auths you to become a leader, you are sent to another city to take control, or become the Godfather if you wish. At some point someone proves their loyalty to you, you give them auth, later on your auth is involved in an altercation with Deimne, the argument is heated and war seems inevitable. What would you do? Back your own city leader or side with Deimne?

I think on the outset, most people want to say that they would stand up
and fight for their own family first and then for the people who have
supported them. But when the matter changes because your own family and
your supporters are separate, or because you changed cities, or because
you can't back a decision they are making... That's when you look to
your own borders and do what's right by the people you serve. 

Im going to have to disagree,  the people who supported you and helped you get to wear you are, are you. You wouldn't be the person without them.  Espically if you came from their cities, your blood still pumps with their city. Moved to another then your blood should have both spots.  In the end its not the words of your enemies that you remeber, but the silence of your friends.  I have been in postions where i have called on friends, and they knew there might be no coming back.  Did they studder or fall behind, no they were right there next to me.

In the end all we have is friends. Im not speaking ill about my Godmother or any descions of the other fine leaders in our life, but you have to remeber where you came from. Remeber how you got there because one day you might have to go back to where you came form, and either be welcomed or hated.

Carnifex listens to Achilles

It truly all depends in my personal opinion. Yes, Deimne  gave me auth but if feel like if my captain wasn't wrong by any means then I will stand up for him. Now, if he was in the wrong then I will back Deimne 100%.   I pretty much predict someone will pop-up and say, "well, what about your loyalty to Deimne?" This has nothing to deal with loyalty. This deals with standing up in what you believe is right. It will probably be in my best interest for my families longevity to back Deimne. Please keep in mind this my own personal feeling and thought.

Carnifex shuts his mouth seeing how he starts ramble on in his head

In all honesty, wrong or right, to me you should stand by your people, and the ones who have always been there for you.

Right or wrong, if your my man your my man, and ill have you 100%. All you need to do is so say so. 

Many moons ago, friends of my ancestors came to me saying oh this and that is going on, did i ask what they did or ask why they made so and so mad?  No I took some time and called the Jonnie_ Reese and deaded some people up.

Right or wrong, friends are your family.

Gaius pulled a cigarette from his pocket and nods at Leviathan in total agreement.

In all honestly, to answer your question Achilles, my loyalty is to the individual that gave me the start 100%. In my frame of mine... when you give your loyalty to an individual, my Godfather, or my Crew Leader for instance. That loyalty NEVER goes away. Just because they gave me a city, etc

I understand that many, legends think differently. However, for me, the line here is clear. However, after spending HOURS in discussion with the Godfather, I can see why other's arn't like me, and I respect them for it.

Pretty much everything you just said was wrong, Leviathan. This is not merely my opinion, either. It is contained in one of the four pillars of Cosa Nostra - Famiglia. The pillar of Famiglia is where we find the importance of Loyalty in Cosa Nostra. Loyalty applies ONLY to your family, not to friends or anyone else. You have quite a few opinions based on what you think is right, but those views do not jive too well with our traditions.

"the people who supported you and helped you get to wear you are, are you."

No, I am me, and my family, by extension, are part of who I am. If I were to be given a blessing to branch off, then I would have a new family - my own family. Family is where the loyalty must lie.

Espically if you came from their cities, your blood still pumps with their city.

No, there is nothing in the tenets or traditions of Cosa Nostra which prescribes loyalty to a city. There is only loyalty to family. Family are those who are in your immediate hierarchy - not those who are former associates or who you sip coffee with every day.

Moved to another then your blood should have both spots.

No, blood or Sangue, is another pillar of Cosa Nostra. It refers to the duty to avenge a wound, neatly tied in with the pillar of Famiglia - an attack on one is an attack on all. So, an attack on yourself is the same as an attack on your family. It is not the same as an attack on a family in another city.

In the end its not the words of your enemies that you remeber, but the
silence of your friends.  I have been in postions where i have called
on friends, and they knew there might be no coming back.  Did they
studder or fall behind, no they were right there next to me.

If you substitute every place you said "friends" with "Famiglia", then you would have an accurate statement of the duty of loyalty a family owes to each other. Friends ain't shit. If your Boss tells you to shoot your friend, you have a duty of loyalty to put a gun to his head and pull the trigger. In the mafia, our killers come with smiles on their faces.

In the end all we have is friends.

No, in the end, all we have is Famiglia. That is the reason we are organized and manage to stay out of prison.

Remeber how you got there because one day you might have to go back to where you came form

No, I'm not going back anywhere. I swore an oath to this family. It was a blood oath. I swore that the only way I would leave would be in a coffin.

I will repeat, the only duty of loyalty you owe is to your family, and your family is only those who you work with. If someone branches out on their own, they no longer work with you. They have their own family. That's it. End of. If they are not in your family, anything you do to benefit them is simply a favor. It is not a duty or an obligation. To a family, you owe both a duty and an obligation. If you have to weigh the two and make a decision, the well being of your family wins every time.

That is, unless you are not a mobster. If that is the case, by all means, go play ring around the rosie with your Friends.

Levianthan, I will agree with you but at the same time I will disagree with you as well.

I see your point about your friends because my past ancestors stood by their friends and so would I now. I mean it's pretty much what you believe in overall. We could all go back and forth about this one but it would be pointless. I think we realize this one but someone will always say something about it.

"In all honestly, to answer your question Achilles, my loyalty is to the
individual that gave me the start 100%."

I would agree with this. Pledging loyalty to your leader is the basis of what keeps people and families solvent in this thing of ours.

"That loyalty NEVER goes away."

I agree with this when it comes to operating within the same city as the person who gave you your start, as you're still an extension of their organization, and have been given the authorization to work under them (in most cases, although there are some exceptions). Further illustrating this loyalty, is the fact that you're working toward the common goal of making your city as powerful as possible, and will defend it at all costs. Pride in ones city runs deep, as do the business relationships that form as a result of that.

Just because they gave me a city, etc

This is where I respectfully disagree with you, Gaius. As the head of a city, you have a responsibility to those who are operating within your city, to protect them and help them flourish at all costs. Your loyalties change, so to speak, when you are put into that position. That isn't to say you should lose sight of what got you there, but the priority in which you deal with matters may change. I'd have to agree with the talking points that Godfather Deimne had outlined to you in regard to loyalties, as I feel he has hit the nail on the head when it comes to the decision making process of a Godfather or city head.

This quote really drives that point home, at least to me:

"If it benefits New York for me to enter into a war, I will, but I will
never put a New York life at risk if it isn't in the best interest of
the city."

The interests of the Godfather are clearly stated here; he makes decisions that are in the best interest of his city, and that is the driving force behind the way he operates on a daily basis. 

To add to what you've already laid out, is the idea of Friendship vs. Family, that seems to be prevalent in what you've just discussed here. My view is that family always comes first, no matter what. Others may state that friends are family, and that is a fair viewpoint, but where do you draw the line and just have to act on your own merits?

Loyalty

What can I say? I come from a Philly family and have had my precious times of glory.. A sleepless bum pulls up a gun unexpectedly and that is the way my leader goes.. Happened before, will happen again..

However, I am thriving where I am now and as for loyalty.. Sure, I will always have respect for my elders and those who taught me the business here... But (and that's a big "but") I am loyal to the family I belong to as well as I am loyal to my deceased friends....

So.. the big question is (I guess) who should you be loyal to?

With or without my experiences, I would say whoever has brought you up in this Thing of Ours and whoever has showed you the ropes.. Spent time with you and your mates.. Having you understand the business we are involved in... 

THAT's who you should be loyal to.. Enough said!

Again bringing an interesting topic to the streets Gaius, I am sorry that this time I'll have to disagree with you, A family's business should be in the top of any leader's priorities, when someone becomes a city head he can't go support another city head in a war,just because that person had graced him by giving him this auth. That would totally contradict to his new city and family's business
When we first joined this thing of ours, Gaius. We were told that family comes first, so if a city head acted the way you think should be the right thing, that would totally contradict with his Family's interest and what we have been teaching new comers to our world for ages.
In the end of the day, If you looked at the subject from a more accurate point of view, you will find that the leader's death was better for your family's business.
{$}ilvio

Arsenal, that could cover a wide range of people, including mafiosi that may not even be in your city, let alone family. As for being loyal to deceased friends, how is this so? They are deceased.

In my opinion, the short answer to your big question is simple. Your Family.

Gaius listens to everyone speak before him, and takes all of there opinions into consideration

Many, will answer this question politically incorrect, but I'm curious how it will turn out regardless.

Who is your loyalty to, your Crew Leader or your cities Godfather?

Drexl in tha house. Even when he's outdoors he's in tha house.

What does Kates have to do with anything? And what does your second question have to do with your original point? Your bloodline's undying loyalty is all well and good, and if you were in her shoes maybe you would have acted differently. That's all well and good too. I wouldn't have. Not in this case.

It's not a question that need be one or the other. Presumably it's both.

I was referring to Gaius' question by the way.

Gaius, An honest answer which is right in my opinion is that my loyalty is to my leader who is loyal to his Godfather therefore I am loyal to both my Leader and Godfather.

i remember that its being talked about this matter many times before...answers are almost same, politic...i can understand , may be it is what it has to be, since talkin about this mention is like walkin on a thin ice ,a wrong answer would end up their death..but still, honestly, i agree with every single word you said , Mr Gaius...o/

I'm not quite sure how all the other cities work but in Las Vegas we have Godfathermothertuckersomeotherprefix Lucretia_Borgia as Gwarble would like to say. She has Cryptic and Youngsta both are underbosses to Lucretia which is merely an extension of the family. Under them you have Giovanni which is a captain to Cryptic. So in the whole line of leaders in Las Vegas it all goes back to Lucretia.

What I'm trying to say is that your loyalty is to every leader in the city since you are all family. The only difference is there's different leaders of different regimes.