I wasn't asking you to convince me Logan because I think they both did what they felt was best for themselves and that makes me think it was a good decision for them given the information they had :D

My words aren't to question anyone's involvement or abilities. They're there to just ask you if you really mean what you said, I thought I understood what you meant but I can't agree that it comes down to one thing like you said :D

I just wanted to say that there were probably more factors than those listed and that your idea of blind loyalty is dumb should also apply to the member/crew leader relationship because a lot of people seem to believe claiming to have blind loyalty to their Crew Leader is a good policy :D

Mr. Wargasm, I believe your ability to understand why others jump ship is a good thing and I thank you for stating your side and the ability to understand the other side. You've set high prices for the cost of being called a turn-coat or angering potential friends and that is a judgment call that many can respect, I just hope that others will try to accept the existence of the other side of the coin as well. I also believe there are better words for your side than blind loyalty, but that's just word play :D

Mr. Phillistein I have to ask you why only a Crew Leader can turn on someone who trusts them, and why a member can't? There are lots of people who feel the Crew Leader doesn't have their best interests but don't jump ship because it isn't worth the troubles associated with it. Why can't people draw their own line for when loyalty to a Crew Leader is worth it, like a Crew Leader can for their Godfather? Blood in, blood out sounds like asking someone to shut their eyes and trust after they hit a certain point to me. I know that's a crude way of stating it, but I can't see any benefits to trusting someone that much if they can't live up to that trust :D

Scorpion is enticed by the speech Diablos is giving since it proves a very good point

I only have one thing to say about this topic, the truth is survival is the only thing that matters in this thing of ours. You cant trust anyone really, and that whole leaving your family in times of war deal is a flip of the coin 50% you will die or live. Even if people set up rules saying you can't join another family in times of war; people would find a way around it like anything that is prohibited such as alcohol and how we are bootlegging. 

Scorpion clears his throat

Who cares what others think, our only goal is to reach Godfather and run a city besides that everything is worthless. 

Who cares what others think, our only goal is to reach Godfather and run a city besides that everything is worthless. 

Is it though?

Really?

Because that sure as fuck isn't my goal. That sure as fuck wasn't my mothers goal, that sure as fuck wasn't her mothers goal - in fact, that's never really been a huge deal to any member of my bloodline. If we never take on the Godfather spot, I highly doubt it'll be looked back on as a regret or even a shame.

My goal is more to do my best for the people around me than to do things to advance my own position. My mothers goal was to protect her crew til her last breath. There is so much more to our world than being a Godfather. So, so much more.

I was taught that a person has to be true to their believes, whatever that believe may be.
Personally, I think that you should follow your leader, even it means you're going to die for sure.
That raises the question to which leader you're more committed to, your CrewLeader or your GodFather?

If your CL is the GF you obviously don't have that problem..

But then again, if your target is to stay alive whatever the cost... You can't be committed to anyone but yourself.