I am not saying people should be disloyal to a Godfather. But loyalty is a far stretch for someone who views you as not worth interacting with. It is the people that make the family great. Not always the bold and italic suits. They are a minority. So if you aren't interacting with them then what could you possibly expect? I should hope not loyalty.

Very well said, and couldn't be said better. 

"Some respect based on rank? I suppose.  The concept of blind loyalty has never made sense to me personally though."- Ryssa.

Polo nodded with enthusiasm. 

"Exactly! If you, as a leader in a community do not take the time to get to know those that are working and providing for you, then why should they support you? Many of those in Upper Echelons appear to hold the power, however it is those that provide and pay tribute that have the most power... although they often don't realize that. It is these people, the masses, that can truly make change if they see fit, thus gaining loyalty from the masses is needed for the people in the Upper Echelons to benefit."

Exactly Polo A GF has no power if he/she is not trusted, thus is why in this thing of our many leaders garner more respect then GF simply because the lot of them interact with their associates.  While of course there are some that just are there for a bold suit and thus lead to multiple suicides of associates trying to find a better home.  But most do not seem to realize that a GF is pretty much a face in this world of ours unless they truly mingle with others and that's why people tend to follow a CL more so.

Most definitely my crew leaders.  I don't have a lot of ancestors' journals to draw from for knowledge of this life of ours - so much of the information I obtain comes from my Crew Leader.  Much of what I know, who I am and how I conduct myself is based on the advice and teachings given to me by my Crew Leader.  This - makes my loyalty to them unwavering.  In addition, my demise is likely about 99.9% assured if something should ever happen to my Leader.  My life is directly tied to his.  Here's to Siriusblack and the late, great Illfated!! (GRHS)

Misti raises his beer in the air and takes a large pull.

my loyalty would be to the godfather of my district tbh unless what was happening was the gf at fault and would be best for the district 

So if your GF does something wrong, but your loyal to him/her.  But they are in the wrong you should be able to go on living? yet that GF made the choice.  So you're saying you should be able to turncoat if that person is in the wrong but you swore loyalty to fight with that one?

Loyalty is not convenient. More often then not it will cost you everything you are. This is why I can't stress enough that you should ask questions before you join your leader. Have a conversation. Don't rush head first because you really should know what is expected of you, what the family is aiming for and just whatever information you can learn to make your decision.

Decide what it is you are looking for and find a leader or Godfather that is looking into the same direction as you are. Or at least someone you think is worth dying for. Frankly, chances are you will die for your leader or your Godfather regardless. Make your choices so that you can live your life to the fullest.

I am loyal to the leader I am blooded to, end of.  My mother before me instilled this within me when I was just a little girl, and when her famiglia was taken out and she was left standing, she handed her gun over to the victors of the war and asked to be shot, as she felt that being left standing in a field of dead bodies would bring her nothing but shame and would leave me forever shamed by her actions.  So instead she chose to die, standing proud and with her honor intact.  But that was her choice.  I suppose there are time where if everyone around you has died and you have an opportunity to revive your family name in the same city, without having to join the factions that brought your leaders down, then you can but try.  But to leave your city and family and blood merely for safety seems like the worst kind of way to survive. 

Quill noticed Ryssa quickly take the streets once more. He laughed as she rolled her eyes. Silly girls. Then there was that Theon_Greyjoy. Oh boy. The people in this life these days. As he thought these things to himself Quill continued to listen.

How is trusting in your Godfather, even if he never speaks a word to you directly, blind loyalty? In any other profession when you sign up to be apart of an organized work force you trust that the man on top will keep cutting your checks each week. To have trust is to have faith and to have faith does not make you blind. 

I must agree with Aniki. It does seem that a lot of people miss the concept of what a family is. The difference between my example of a job outside of the mob and one within is that the mob is life. Blood in, blood out. If you want to punch a card twice a day to bring home money to feed the kids go find work at one of the many factories across our country, but if you want to be apart of something bigger than yourself, well, that’s why we’re all here. 

Though, if the big guy who’s name is on the factory’s walls makes a bad decision and the business goes to shit, you aren’t required to go down with the ship. You can take your experience and fuck off. Not in the mob. You join up with a crew and the leader serves under a Godfather and that Godfather fucks everything up, you’re going down with the ship. 

There seems to be a lot of people attempting to hold up the argument that if a Godfather never talks to every single person in their district they are not worthy of their member’s loyalty. A lot of me, me, me’s. A lot of ‘What about us little guys, don’t we get any attention? Don’t we matter?’ Hell yes you matter, getting a personalized greeting card from your Godfather should not prove that. You should just know that, trust that you are apart of something bigger than yourself. 

A Godfather considers each member, but in on much larger scale than your crew leader. A Godfather is apart of every single life that works under him. Some examples: keeping food on your plate, money in your pocket, shelter over your head. I’m almost positive that every single Godfather does speak to their members by sending out mass telegrams. Though, I'm sure this isn't good enough for certain people. Godfather’s have eyes on their members, all of their members. They use the crew leaders under them as useful tools to keep closer eyes on each member. If a member fucks up, it’s handled by their crew leader and in some cases, directly by the Godfather. Your Godfather has the power to decide if you keep breathing or if you’ll be swimming with the fishes. 

I’d like to hear less about what your Godfather can do for you, but what you can do for your Godfather. Like give him your “blind” loyalty. 

It has nothing to do about not trusting a GF you seem to be confused, and pulling in a everyday job vs Mafia is a very poor example.

Simply put there are GF's that will congratz promos from made-man and up and familiarize themselves with members other then by the leader which to you is only an assumption with no solid evidence.  Has nothing to do with blind loyalty, the same thing though can be said about a GF how are we to trust a person who hasn't even as so much as sent out a mass mail.  A person that is a GF and is on once a week if that or if on at all isn't on more than 30 minutes.

My fathers journals use to talk about times when GF's were in the streets consistantly and now we are very rarely ever getting to see an appearance by one.  Respect and loyalty are earned and not given, I will not respect someone I do not know or hardly see.  Let alone a person that cannot even send out a mass mail or mumble the words "hi".  Take my words and change them however you see fit, the journal here already shows a pretty clear point that more people trust their CL then a GF.  That obviously shows a huge change from when my kin fold before me landed, maybe this will have a impact on the way GF's carry themselves and maybe it won't but I know I sure as hell would love to see more participation from GF's in this world of ours.

Quill clapped for Mr. Greyjoy. It seemed the oocitis had gotten to his brain and it was rotting away. 

Chuckles for a brief moment.

I'm sure the oocitis far more affected you when you started talking about a day job of us clocking in and a company boss etc, but thats just my opinion Star-Lord sir.

Chuckles again and looks for some wine.

Fips covers his face with the palm of his hand.

Ser Robert Strong was walking around the streets when he swa people in a wild discussion about loyalty. And Robert being a  knight he has his own oppinion. As he walks closer he sees theon greyjoy grabing another bottle of wine, and fips seems to be there to. The discussion is quiet so Robert walks up and starts his stalk.

"I know you have been at this for some time but i've only just arived at this discussion. But I just like to give my own opinion on this matter. I think my loyalty lies with my crew leader, and my GF needs to work for my respect and loyalty."

Robert looks around and takes a glass of wine from Theon. 

"The Crew where you work and aare part of is the crew that gave you the change. The change to grow and become someone that is a respectefull part of this world. So as you gett into a crew you are owed your loyalty to your crew. The GF on the other hand is a diffent story, you could say that you are loyal to your leader and he is loyal to his GF, So you are Loyal to your GF."

Robert takes a sip from the wine.

"But i think things are a bit different, your GF is a step outside of your crew. But you don't have as much contact with him compared with your crew. This is not the problem but you might not agree with the things that your GF does. My father had a Gf that was not the person that you would hear a lot about. But he had the respect of my father, he got that respect because of the way he would act during wars. "

"On the other hand GF don't always get the resspect from everyone down the line. And this is also because of choises that are made, those choices might not agree with the some of the crews. The leaders of the crew do respect those choices but this is a reason why a member of a crew hasn't any influence in the actions of the tops."' 

"So if you're not at the top of your crew, you won't be someone that reacts to the GF about the actions he takes. You can't tell him out of nothing that you don't agree with what he has done. And because sometimes the information doesn't get to the rest of the crew the act of loyalty can't be asked from everyone in the Crew."

Ser Robert Takes another sip from is wine

"So to conclude, As a crew member you should be loyal to your crew and your leader. As a crew leader, and his innercircle, needs to be loyalt to the GF. But al the other people in the crew don't have to be loyal to the GF, but the GF can get this respect. This respect can be earned by acting in a honerable way and explaining why something was handled the way it was handled. "

Then robert walks off and takes a anther glass of wine from Theon, that seemed to get a bit mad because al his wine is being taken by Robert. But he seemed to get a bit happier when he saw Robert pulling up a chair next to him and ordering two new bottles of wine

 

in my opinion yes you should be loyal to your crew leader but your upmost loyalty should rest with your godfather if he aint spoke to you get to know him end of the day he is still your leader your crew leader just runs it for the godfather in that respect in my opinion my loyalty would lay more with my gf and district than my cl

Ryssa smiled when she listened to Star-Lord. He was certainly entertaining but he would never change her stance. So she just listened a little longer.

How could I possibly believe that someone who takes no interest in those in their district could have the best interests of the district at heart? That is silly, isn't it? If a Godfather can't be assed to know their people, then why should we be assed to be loyal to them?

Blind loyalty is going along with anything, claiming loyalty to anything, just because you are told to. No siree that is not how I roll around these parts.

Again though I must reiterate that it hardly seems a problem if the crewleader is loyal to the Godfather. It only becomes a problem when they are not.

My loyalty lays with anyone who I am working for and shows the most utterest respect and Loyalty back. But at the same time I don't choose a state unless I will be loyal to it as a whole. Of coarse I am loyal to my GF but at the end of the day anyone that shows respect has my loyalty and trust.. Loyalty and trust works both ways to me and takes two to create such a bond.. The inner workings of my own crew always catches my interested so I guess anyone that I am currently working with has my Loyalty and full trust until proven other whys. I always give everyone the "benefit of the doubt" I guess you could say..

One must always swear loyalty and fealty to the mighty Bearderus of feel his wrath.

One must always swear loyalty and fealty to the mighty Bearderus of feel his wrath.

Well said my old friend Kurgan. 

"How could I possibly believe that someone who takes no interest in those in their district could have the best interests of the district at heart?"

Ryssa There is no way you could possibly know that. Just because a Godfather doesn't talk to you on a regular basis, doesn't mean they aren't checking up on how things are via their leaders. Using South Philly as an example, do you expect Lynchy to speak to all 68 guys within his family regularly? It's unrealistic to think so although in most cases you are possibly right that some Godfathers do not consider the associates within their families, I mean why would they? These guys haven't even been sworn in yet, you can't expect them to be on a personal level with a Godfather. However those who have been sworn in and are part of the family, I would expect a Godfather to be taking notice of these guys, even if it's indirectly and I would expect those who have received their button to have a better understanding when it comes to the concept of "The Family" and therefore would show a greater loyalty to their Godfather.

"That is silly, isn't it? If a Godfather can't be assed to know their people, then why should we be assed to be loyal to them?"

Because you are a part of that family, you don't give to receive, you just give. If you give enough and work hard enough, your efforts should be rewarded.