DeadWinchester, you aren’t a commoner, you’re just an earner. You haven’t even made it officially into your family yet. You do not hold the rank of Made Man. Though you feel the need to come to the streets and add your worthless two cents in with sarcastic questions. You don’t need to state your opinions in questions, they still come off as rude. You think there is a problem with a reason not given even though you bring another problem to the table. Next time would you put a little more effort into your reply, earner. 

An explanation was given after one was requested. Though it was short and sweet JackLuciano did tell us it was a decision amongst the Godfathers. Does he really need to come out and find his own street corner and tell us an elaborate reason to why Roquelaure is now in his district or how the decision was made? Nope. One, it was a Godfather(s) decision. Two, this seems to be the business of JakeLuciano and Suburbs business. Sure there are curious folks out there, but if every little thing is explained people will start complaining that there is no mystery left in our world. What’s the point of telling everything when we’re suppose to have our individual crews, districts and cities. 

Yes, it was a public contest and a public vote. We got to see how the votes stacked up and we were given introductions from each winner, but after that those who were chosen by the public didn’t come to the streets each time they did something in their crew. This wasn’t a glass house contest. After the first part of the contest was done it wasn’t really a public thing any more. We had no business to inquire what was going on in Staten Island. 

I personally believe that this is a good move for our community. Too many Godfathers, too many bold suits, but Staten Island didn’t need to feed into that problem with five auths within the same district. I like that the district has now spread out. 

Ziva, it’s not just how our world is set up. A big part of our problems are the people in it and how we do things, how much weight we put into things, how much we hold ourselves accountable as leaders and members to how we want to mold our world or how we think our world should be. How the leaders decide how to set up our world and how the people agree or disagree with the things that are put into place. A world is given to us, the people are the ones who decide how it will be shaped. 

Just like Pocket pointed out, a leader of our community (as they wear a slanted suit) TeofiloNicolosi didn’t know of the street speech and reasons behind the take down of The Loop and Black Bottom. Should I quickly blame how the world is set up for his/her lack of knowledge?

With ToyArmadillo moving into his own district and JakeLuciano picking up Roquelaure, it’s a smart move. I’m sure many of you would have decided to do the same if you were in their positions. If you were in that position, letting one of the auths under move to another district and arranging for a prior member of Chicago join you in your district, coming to the streets would be near the bottom of the list while you situated and organized your district. That’s what comes first isn’t it?

Tokyo, I don't think it's solely a problem with the set up of our world, no.

I do think though, that the set up of our world does feed strongly into other problems.

You mention yourself that there are too many Godfathers, and too many bold suits, and I more than agree with that. The fact that for the good of the people remaining, these districts HAVE to be filled is the main cause of that, I think. It's not that people are too scared to let a district close for business for a while, it's that once they open, whether or not the population is in a place to sustain them without these kind of issues, they have to remain open lest those who act against the previous inhabitants get shot to shit.

Now, it's not JUST a matter of too many Godfathers and bold suits. It's also that all these people in bold, they need hands. Looking at the mobsters going about their business at any given time and it seems like most of those people will be wearing either a bold or slanty suit.

With a small population and so many crews, it opens up more hand spots to people who may not previously have been considered for the position, because most leaders want both hand spots filled.

While it'd be nice to say that this world is what we make of it, when we end up in a position where we have mobsters with busy alternate lives or something of that nature having to take on spots, we're going to end up with less informed hands. Because in a small community, you're still going to have a fairly high proportion of people who can't dedicate all that much time. More spots of importance mean that they are likely to become easier to obtain.

I don't mean this as an attack on Teofilo, I know you're a pretty busy guy, and it's easy to overlook things when you have other concerns. I've done it myself.

DeanWinchester, so glad of you to join us again. This current discussion is about the Staten Island competition, those who had won the votes of the community and how the district is playing out. That is what I replied to. I doubt you listened to what I said after I pointed out that you are just an earner, which I'll come back to in a moment. 

Yes, it was a public contest and a public vote. We got to see how the votes stacked up and we were given introductions from each winner, but after that those who were chosen by the public didn’t come to the streets each time they did something in their crew. This wasn’t a glass house contest. After the first part of the contest was done it wasn’t really a public thing any more. We had no business to inquire what was going on in Staten Island. 

Now, lets go back to your rank. You could have any rank you wanted to, sure, anyone can have any rank they want to have, but right now, you are just an earner. In Godfather Cantona's speech the other day about made men my right hand Kilgore said it best.

There used to be an understanding in this business, and maybe there still is on some level, that until you made your bones, you were just a warm body. You filled a slot, stood in line, and acted as a human shield if it came down to it. Cash cow. Work horse. Drug mule. See the theme? Take the title in its most literal sense. When you got your button, it made you a man in this thing of ours. Only then do you get the full respect and consideration of your peers.

Earner: Cash cow, warm body. When you become a made man you are truly apart of the family, you have a purpose besides racking in the money. You're boss knows you by name, your Godfather knows you exist. So yes, if you are are a higher rank your words will hold more weight. For now, you're just an earner. Yes, you can walk around on these streets and say whatever you want, but every action has a consequence which may be good or bad. You might like it, you might not.

Since you claim that you learned from good teachers like myself, I'll give you some more free advice. You actually do have to impress people. You have to impress your crew leader for the ranks you claim will come so easy for yourself. You have to impress the public that we should care about what you say instead of just write it off as "oh that's just what his bloodline does, you can never expect much from him". 

You have to impress the public that we should care about what you say instead of just write it off as "oh that's just what his bloodline does, you can never expect much from him". 

Apparently, public opinion means jack shit which is why we're often left out in the cold.

Unless I missed something I'd like to know what happened to this entire fucking "contest", it seems to be a gigantic crock of shit now. I'm slightly annoyed at it and the lack of information "given" to us. It was put in place for a purpose and has morphed into other purposes without a word in advance as to what the fuck is going on. It was "for the people" yet we don't have a right to know what the fuck is going on with it?

Frustration? Yeah, you got me, frustration is setting in at this silence when it comes to shit that actually matters.

You're right, John. Public opinion does mean jack shit in the Mafia. Glad you're catching on. You're a mobster, and as a mobster you live by certain unwritten rules, these rules entail that the people in charge are in charge until someone deems them unfit and puts a bullet in their skull, but in the meantime they can nearly do whatever the fuck they want, whenever the fuck they want. Is it fair? In a way, yes. They all worked to get where they are, and they are entitled to all of the advantages, which include not having to answer questions the second that the average mobster demands them. It may not be fair to you, exactly, but then again, this is the Mafia and it never has to be fair.

Quite simply put, you can be as frustrated as you'd like, but nobody really has to care.

I agree with you to a point Fry.

Public opinion does however mean something. As it directly influences if someone is going to put a bullet between your eyes.

Public opinion matters massively in terms of how much support you can gather from your allies. If you are generally disliked then people will not be that inclined to jump to your aid. Especially if they are on the side of the public who think you are a complete dickhead.

Now admittedly, If you have 200 BG's and have 1000 notches in your gun then public opinion means a lot less to you but it should never be fully ignored.

As a Crewleader if you are not fair then you do not have support of your people. That is the most important thing. Without the support of your family you are finished. Fair to the general people of this world? No. I suppose you don't have to be. But I feel that it's a dangerous road to walk down. If you are unable to show compassion in these Street it will resonate and it will leave doubts in people minds in future dealings with you.

I don't know what mafia world you think you live in.....but this isn't fucking it. What you described is not what this fucking is, you know it and I know it so let's not beat around this bush.

We work within a different set of "rules" and an altered version of a "code". This is the fucking mafia and public opinion is supposed to mean shit...

Oh am I the only one asking questions? No I am not others who are made are and are not getting answers either so don't try to make this about rank when it's not. It's about people who call the shots not speaking about a matter that they chose to involve the public opinion in the first place so yes they do owe us something especially when a stink was made to those who disagreed in the first place. I'm also thrilled to know what you think of all your crew members until they donate enough for you to give them made, very enlightening and I'm sure many people can't wait to not have their boss know their name or think of them as anything more than a shield, I'm happy I've never been in a family like that.

I have to echo that those of us who voiced disenchantment with these contest districts in the first place were complained strongly about in certain circles, only to be proved right.

I'd be interested to see if those who admonished us for negativity and the like will now be willing to turn around and admit we weren't wrong.

Pocket, I'm referring to ANY Godfather who was orchestrated this war. So yes, I am referring to my own Godfather, as well as others. You say that I should be cleaning house. I am trying to make a difference in this piss poor show of no speeches about important events. However, I am not in a position to be making said speeches, all I can do is prod and encourage it to be happening much quicker.

TokyoZombi, I personally DO know of the reasons behind the war. However, everybody who doesn't have the access to the same information we do, does not. They deserve to know as well. This was not just a random removal of a Capo who had messed up, this was the entire removal of two districts, that NEEDS to be addressed.

Also, after reading the speech from Dripple, a lot of things are still very unclear. So we know why Dripple felt like Viene needed removing, why did Chicago get involved at all? Was it anything to do with them? Why did they feel like Penquin should be removed as well? Dripple said himself, he was only giving the reasons for his own personal involvement.

Before something is said about my apparent support of Penquin and Viene, and that I am only looking to bash the current Godfathers, I thought the takedown was actually necessary. I was not a fan of Penquin, and I couldn't care less that they died, I really couldn't. I'm not out here for my benefit, as I already said, I know what happened. Other people deserve to know too.

I hate how this has become a reply solely based on another topic, so I'll go back to the topic that this speech was actually for.

If everybody that wasn't a Made Man, didn't come to these streets to voice their 'worthless two cents' as you so stupidly put it, the streets would be even more dead than they already are. As a Leader, you should be trying to make this world a better place to be apart of, not bashing the shit out of someone for coming out and giving their opinion on recent events.

The reason JakeLuciano gave wasn't short and sweet, it was short and shit. A two sentence reason for the supposed head of a district backing out of the 'competition' and moving into an already established district, is absolutely fucking ridiculous, and I think that deep down, you know it is. I understand you do not want to be seen as a leader who doesn't have faith in the other leaders around here, but damn, grow some metaphorical balls.

Teofilo, I beleive you missed my point a little bit.

My point is that as a LHM to a Godfather, you represent that family, you represent that district, so you DO speak for your family and district. Every single word that comes out of your mouth or any member that is part of the high structure of a leader, is representing that leader.

You said that you personally KNOW the reasons, and that you also beleive that the community in general should know such reasons. So perhaps instead of just questioning and accusing others for their lack of speech, you should clarify the reasons your own family got into it because after all YOU REPRESENT YOUR OWN FAMILY.

And also, if Jake explained enough or not, that's surely debatable, however, once again a LHM to a godfather coming here and saying his speech was shit, that in my views is disrespectful.  We can stay here preaching all day about what people should or shouldn't do, but once we step over one of the most important principals of this thing of ours, respect, we need to turn around and go back to learning the basics first.

There's a difference between putting in effort and giving your two cents vs being upset and complaining that you haven't gotten the full story from a district you aren't even apart of. There's also a difference of stating your opinion respectfully and being completely disrespectful. Sometimes it not what you say, but how you say it. 

We live in a shell, there is no depth to what we claim to stand for.

It wasn't about it being a district thing it never was a district thing. They had two competitions and some openly as well as behind closed doors slammed many who disagreed with it and now that one has backfired completely and the other one looks really silly, so yes in my earner mind and I'm sure in a few others they do owe something maybe not a full explanations but a 3 line answer after everything that has been said and done is not the leadership I hope to see run this thing of ours. Even if it wasn't a glass house competition with that many people dying, stepping down and moving if it was a regular district there still would have been an explanation and the fact that there isn't makes the people who planned this whole thing look like the didn't care in the first place.

If I have been genuinely disrespectful, then I apologise. Respect is a core value in this place, and I would never try to disrespect anyone, especially someone of higher stature than myself.

However, I believe I am merely saying what a lot of people are thinking.

I have not come out and explained things to do with our district, as our district was not the main 'attacker' so to speak. I do represent my own family, thank you for clarifying that, although the raised voice was not really needed. Are you going deaf? Or are you now showing disrespect? Pot. Kettle. Black.

Why does it make a difference whether I'm a LHM or not, when it comes to disrespect? If it's disrespectful, it's disrespectful, end of story.

Would you like to join me, back in the classroom Pocket? Seeing as though you think I need to learn again, it seems you need a refresher as well.

I'm not going deaf neither being disrespectful. I put enphasis where I beleived it was needed just like you have done in a previous speech. If you felt offended by my words or something like that, then you have my apologies.

You are correct, disrespect is disrespect, however in my views, to see that coming from someone that holds a position of power, it gets aggravated.

I don't think I need to go back to class just now, thank you for the invite, I'll keep it in mind and if it's ever needed, I'll join you.

I am not going to quote verbatim here as I am way too lazy for that, but  TokyoZombi dismissing someone due to their rank regardless of the content of their speech is shocking especially from a leader, who should know that an Earner could one day save your life, if that is how you view people who aren't made in your family I feel sorry for anyone that hasn't yet reached the rank of made as they are just viewed as a number to fill the HQ.

We aren't asking for every decision to be told to us but as I said earlier when you decide on making contest and then meddle with them with no explanation how many people do you think will step forward for the next contest?

You say Staten Island disn't need to add to the too many Godfathers and Crew leaders but one leader stepped down and my leader moved to the Suburbs so net value we lost 1 Leader. A Crew Leader moved to Brooklyn and took Godfather and authed another person so by my maths since the contest was changed we have gained a Godfather and remained the same. Yes I know Aaron was removed from Staten Island but that has nothing to do with the point you were trying to make.

Sycamore, does rank mean anything to you? Should we as a community just take the ranking system out? Should we just accept every poor reply and chalk it up to a learning process even though no one is learning, changing and everyone is lazy including yourself. DeanWinchester's reply was poor, I wanted better quality from an earner. Though, that's unfair of me to say, but you can say it to me when what I've said is supposedly shocking, especially when it's coming from a leader. How can you hold my rank and position out in the sun, but I can't do the same back. 

Rank means a hell of a lot to me and nowhere have I said that the ranking system is null and void, you were the one that brought rank into this I am just commenting on your comment which was dismissive of Earners. If you had said that his comment was poor then this would not be a conversation but you didn't. Yes i can bring up that you're a leader like I have already said there was no need to bring his rank into it as a leader you should be wiser with your words.

Actually, Sycamore...as a leader she can get away with far more.She can say things that others can't.  This isn't politics where the guy on top is accountable to everyone else. This is the Mob. 

So, if you have problems with the way TokyoZombi finds associates...well,sad shit. She doesn't need to justify the way she thinks of or treats non Made members of this world to anyone besides maybe her own Godfather.